Will the Pistons' rebounding improve without Ben?

Discussion in 'Pistons and NBA' started by TaS, Oct 12, 2006.

  1. Winless Wonders

    Winless Wonders Starter Forum Donor

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    The rebounding will go down with no Ben. The numbers were going down last year with Ben. Flip's offensive system is not supportive of having the guards and small foward help on the glass which is what this team did when it was coached by Larry Brown. So I think the numbers will go down and just like last year we will have problems with teams that have young atheletic bigs.
     
  2. mercury

    mercury Bench Warmer

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    Hopefully there's less offensive rebounds to be had :^)
     
  3. himat

    himat Bench Warmer

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    Many of the players didn't try hard to crash the boards because they always thought Ben would get it. That's the main reason why this team was a bad rebounding team last season.
     
  4. MotownPride

    MotownPride Starter 2x Fantasy Champion

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    Why wasn't that a problem the previous season, Himat? Seems to be more than just Ben's existence that caused the drop in rebounds.
     
  5. aurora

    aurora Bench Warmer

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    It's because Flip's philosophy is to outshoot the other team. I guarantee you that in our training camp there is not a lot of emphasis on "getting the ball" in the first place but just "score when you get it." Rebounding is almost part of defensive philosophy, which is why Skiles wanted Ben. Ben's biggest value is rebounding at this point. And then all the little things of the way he defends. Without fouling. Ben has a valuable skillset with the new rules too. He can defend without fouling out.
     
  6. max

    max All-Star

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    Other teams manage to rebound with a Ben Wallace. We still have pretty good guys left and still one of the best front courts. We will be fine.

    Its intereresting How the Bulls let one of the best up and comming rebounders go in Tyson Chandler as a cost-saving move. If that happened here we would have ripping on the team all off-season for it.
     
  7. LA Dre

    LA Dre All-Star 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    Tay and Sheed cannot be subsconciously thinking that Ben is going to get the boards and automatically head down court. They need to play more aggresive around the hoop to not only help out Naz, but get their own put backs.

    Looks like as long as JMax gert some decent minutes, he and Dice will provide the help. So far in the preseason they outboarded a lackidasical Heat team and the Grizzlies last night. The problem last night was that our bench who have putting forth a more than decent effort appeared to have gotten outhustled down the stretch

    My concern is that little ignored stat that the Pistons found themselves near the bottom of the league in last year> Points in the paint.

    It didn't hurt that much as they posted the best record, but I think down the stretch and into the post season, teams were able to break down our interior defense EVEN with Ben there and penetrate and score in the paint at will. Even last night the Grizzleis outscored the Pistons in the paint 44-34.

    Yeah with our perimeter game our own PIP last year wasn't that high, but to be successful without Ben, we need to find away to limit the opposition from scoring inside. Yes it will be Tall challenge and I think that should have been one of Flips goals during this preseason is to try to get back to the basics and show the team and the league they could play defense without Big Ben in the middle.:rolleyes: I say if they can limit the opposition to less than 36 points in the paint and they will eek out more W's than expected. :nod:
     
  8. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    Chandler had back problems and a really low bball IQ. Ben is a lot more durable, and a lot more savvy.
     
  9. aurora

    aurora Bench Warmer

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    LA Dre, great analysis here. I had forgotten about that Points in Paint issue. I remember being shocked when I first read that stat. But someone told me that alot of our points are midrange perimeter shots that are almost in the paint. In retrospect that's not good enough, is it? We need PIP for sure. I think Nazr will get us some of them regularly anyway.
     
  10. max

    max All-Star

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    Who is going to have the better season. PJ Brown or Chandler? It was not a choice between Ben or Chandler. They did not want to put an extra 10mil/yr into their frontcourt.

    We are getting 2 more paint scorers. Maxiel and Murry.
     
  11. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    Look, I'm not arguing that the Bulls are better than the Pistons or even re-hashing the Ben Wallace topic as it applies to the Pistons.

    My point is that the Bulls made a short term upgrade at center and that upgrade could be the difference if they had to face Miami again, because last playoffs, they gave the Heat all they could handle. In fact, of the three EC teams the Heat faced, the Bulls played them toughest.

    And yes, it was a choice between Ben and Chandler. They had just re-signed Chandler and grabbed a big man in the draft. To bring Wallace on would have created a logjam. With Brown, they get insurance, and a cap reset next offseason because Hinrich is in need of a new deal and they really like him.

    I hope we got 4 more paint scorers. Murray, Maxiell, Davis and Mohammed. :D
     
  12. MotownPride

    MotownPride Starter 2x Fantasy Champion

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    LA and Aurora, thanks for making my point. :) Didn't get a chance to get it to it, but you covered what I was thinking.
     
  13. max

    max All-Star

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    Yes Mohammed is a 3rd new paint scorer.

    My point was most have been praising the Bulls but if we were in that same situation where a young guy who was finally starting to come around ( and get healthy ) was dumped for salary it would have been ripped on all summer. Yes the reality of the NBA is tough choices have to be made.

    They have Ben, Nocionne ( spelling), a 6'9" rookie that they don't what they are going to get with yet. PJ Brown, Sweetny and a couple of foreign 7'ers that I have never heard of before.
     
  14. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    You're missing Luol Deng, Kirk Hinrich and Ben Gordon.

    They are a good team that can't be called YOUNG much longer. They're starting to mature.
     
  15. mercury

    mercury Bench Warmer

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    I like PJ a lot... I wouldn't sleep on this guy even at his age....
    As you guys mentioned there's a log jam at PF for the Bulls... PJ has also played center. It will be interesting to see what kind of PT the rookie Thomas gets.
    As for Chandler... at the this stage in his career he could have a similar effect as Ben at 32... but he lacks big game experience... which is when Ben usually does his best (unfortunately not in the Heat series).... The Bulls needed someone that can bring winning playoff experience to the table.
    I'd like to recheck the numbers but I think the Bulls front loaded Ben's contract just enough to put us in the lux tax range if we ponied up.
     
  16. max

    max All-Star

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    I only mentioned their frontcourt. It is undersized. That is going to be their largest obsticle and I believe the Chandler trade is going to haunt them. Time will tell.
     
  17. max

    max All-Star

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    Please don't take anything I write in here personally. My judgement is clouded by the fact that I cannot stand the Bulls.
     
  18. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    No worries max. I know where you are coming from.
     
  19. webz

    webz All-Star Snub Administrator 2x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    A log jam of nothing. If one of those guys puts his hand up, no even a finger will do, that spot is theirs. I like PJ too, but he's getting long in the tooth and Sweetney hasn't shown he deserves the minutes. Khryapa? don't think so.

    That spot is gift wrapped for Tyrus Thomas, only thing is he probably isn't ready yet.
     
  20. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    There is an article in the Chicago Trib today about how the Bulls could look at packaging Deng and others to try to grab J O'neal. They are hoping the Pacers decide to dump their current roster of chumps and go for the rebuild.
     

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