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what the Heat title could mean for the NBA and the Pistons

Discussion in 'Pistons and NBA' started by TWOTIMESRALPHI, Jun 22, 2012.

  1. BallDon'tLie

    BallDon'tLie All-Star 3x Fantasy Champion

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    Jim
    Adam Morrison
     
  2. LA Dre

    LA Dre All-Star 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    It's Adam Morrison, 2 time NBA Champion with the back to back lakers championship team of 2009 and 2010. Got two rings without even stepping on the court during the two finals....may not have even dressed....

    Famous for crying in his final collegiate game when Gonzaga loss their game in the final seconds of the sweet 16 to UCLA in 2006. Some lesser known player on UCLA named Aaron Afflollo helped him up off the floor as the teams traded pleasantries and handshakes at the end of the game
     
  3. basketbills

    basketbills All-Star Forum Donor

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    You have to give MJ credit for drafting Morrison.
     
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  4. BallDon'tLie

    BallDon'tLie All-Star 3x Fantasy Champion

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    I think that you over-estimate tha abilities of Monroe and Knight. (they're good, not great - ideal guys to be your 2nd and 3rd best players on a team).
    I think that you under-estimate just how bad the rest of the Pistons roster is from a performance vs contract perspective.

    ...and who's to say that Joe won't offer contract extensions to Ben Gordon and Charlie Villanueva in two years?
     
  5. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    Excellence starts at the top. Great organizations know how to win and accept nothing less. The Pistons have been run like a business, and not a winner for close to 6 years now.

    The Lakers and Celtics of the 80s were loaded with talent. Same thing with the Pistons and Bulls.
     
  6. LA Dre

    LA Dre All-Star 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    Credit or debit? MJ could have done his home work and drafted the ill fated Brandon Roy or even Rudy Gay who were picked about 3-5 picks later or traded way down to select some guy with a funny name called Rondo at the 21st pick..

    Six years later 2006 has to be looked upon as one of the worst drafts ever....only bonafide stars are LaMarcus and Rondo. Brandon Roy suffered the Trailblazer curse and is out of the league and the only others that even get their names mentioned are Rudy Gay, Randy Foye , Shannon Brown, Farmarr, Booby Gibson, Steve Novak, Selfolosha, Millsap and # 1 pick Andrea Barnani
     
  7. Nemo

    Nemo Fantasy-Football Snub Forum Donor

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    Stuckey will get a championship before Mello Carmello
     
  8. Nemo

    Nemo Fantasy-Football Snub Forum Donor

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    He works with fish and bread.........
     
  9. S.J.

    S.J. All-Star Forum Donor

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    But after what you are saying I have to ask to you..
    What have to do a player to become a star to be named as a possible part of any big 3?

    Being in an all-star game or two?
    Have good stats?
    Being the face of the franchise in some crappy team?

    If you are going to measure that by all-star game appearances, then the pistons had a BIG 4.

    If you are going to measure that according to stats.. then it's more complicated, for example:

    Jason Terry numbers from last years finals:

    18.0 ppg (49.4% fg and almost 40% from 3pt)
    3.2 apg - 1.3 steals per game

    Terry averages more point in the finals than Lebron. And Bosh only beat him by 0.5 points per game.

    But of course, I'm not saying that he is part of a BIG 3 with Nowitzki and Kidd. But you can't ignore that he play the series like if he was some kind of star. In those 6 games.

    In the 2009 finals, Rashard Lewis averages really good numbers too

    17.4 ppg - (40% from 3pt) - 7.6 rpg - 4.0 apg

    I recall nobody calling the Magic a Big 3. yet, Turkoglu and Lewis wass the best scoring option they had in that series that went 4 - 1 losing to the Lakers.


    2007 finals:

    Parker: 24.5 ppg - 5.0 rpg - 3.3 apg
    Ginobili: 17.8 ppg - 5.8 rpg - 2.5 apg - 1.3 spg
    Duncan: 18.3 ppg - 11.5 rpg - 3.8 apg - 1.3 spg - 2.3 bpg

    We can all agree that those Spurs were a Big 3, Right?

    Well, this year in the playoffs:

    Parker: 20.1 ppg - 6.8 apg
    Duncan: 17.4 ppg - 9.4 rpg
    Ginobili: 14.4 ppg - 4.0 apg - 3.5 rpg

    By the stats you can tell that was Ginobili the one who drop 6 points in the average from 2010 playoffs (when He averages 20 ppg) to this year.

    Easily you can say that this year, the Spurs have a deep team in Leonard, Danny Green, Neal, etc... But you can't ignore that they have an "Old big 3" (like Boston had this year) to build around. They have the perfect core.

    In this Finals..

    Bosh: 14.6 points - 9.4 rebounds - 1.2 blocks

    Is that "BIG" enough?

    ...

    If it's not measured by the stats.. then what? being the face of a franchise like Bosh in Toronto?

    It's confusing when you start to look "Which player can be named "BIG" to form a BIG 3?"


    So what I do is to judge each player in each series and create if there was a BIG 3 or a BIG 4 or a BIG 2 with impressive role players, for example, 5 players of the Heat averages in double digits in the finals. Battier and Chalmers 10 point something. Wade 22 and Lebron 28. And Bosh 14.

    How do you measure a player to say he is part of a BIG 3?
     
  10. Nemo

    Nemo Fantasy-Football Snub Forum Donor

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    King LeBron would say........just use a ruler to measure.
     
  11. LA Dre

    LA Dre All-Star 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    You mean Stuckey has been traded to the Heat to play back up to his hero King.....Wade?
     
  12. Nemo

    Nemo Fantasy-Football Snub Forum Donor

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    Stuck has been in the league less than Mello, so he has more viable years left to win a championship. Go Stuck!!!
     
  13. linwood

    linwood All-Star

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    Thanks. I didn't realize he was still alive.
     
  14. Ernie the Slow Adult

    Ernie the Slow Adult All-Star Forum Donor

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    Miami is a lock to make it to the ECF next year. It then is just a matter of how they match up, health to see if they'll advance.

    Monroe will need to score consistently if he were ever to make an impact against the Heat. OKC had a yuge size advantage up front but could not take advantage of it. (If there were a drinking game based on the words, "Pass to Perkins underneath, he bobbled it", being said I'd be in a coma.)

    Monroe also could not stay on the court defensively against the Heat. They'd kill him in pick and rolls.

    Looking back I think OKC (and teams going forward) should have pulled a Larry Brown and guarded LeBron 1 on 1 instead of leaving their shooters open. He can't play 45 mpg, guard everyone and score all their points.
     
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  15. S.J.

    S.J. All-Star Forum Donor

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    I didn't knew Morrison tryout for Brooklyn.. I hope thsiguy come back to the nba.. he has the most weirds videos out there.



     
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  16. LA Dre

    LA Dre All-Star 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    I am not so sure about that....when he wanted really score, he went around every Thunder play ala Tay.07, and got to the basket for l for an impossible hoop. He got his own rebound in some instances and accumulated enough assists in each game to create another 15-20 points.
    Win or lose, he was going to generate hater/chatter for the next 10 days until Tiger Woods wins another major PGA championship or Justin Verlanger is accused of taking steroids...
     
  17. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    Sargent Awesome is a good one. I will only refer to him as such going forward.
     
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  18. Ernie the Slow Adult

    Ernie the Slow Adult All-Star Forum Donor

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    Right, but this would be making him score without the assists for 4 quarters. He was getting his and theirs throughout.

    No doubt he would make you sweat while you try and win the battle of attrition.
     
  19. basketbills

    basketbills All-Star Forum Donor

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    SJ...the Adam Morrison motivates Kobe Bryant video is awesome.
     
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  20. The Panda

    The Panda Garbage Post All Star Forum Donor

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    So instead of driving the lane and kicking out to broken ass role players, you suggest forcing him to drive the lane for warmup layups?

    You can't not close down on Lebron. You run the risk on career 35% 3 point shooters, not on one of the most athletically gifted and talented superstars to ever play the game of basketball. And who do you pick to guard him one on one? For OKC the only player than can really match him in strength is Ibaka, and quickness it would be Westbrook. If he gets Ibaka he walks out to the perimeter and isolates, and Westbrook he just backs down to the post. Even if you run really advanced low and high post switches between perimeter defenders, Lebron is smart enough to get the better of them eventually and create either a mismatch for himself or for another. In this series he pulled the perimeter defenders (Sef, Harden, Westbrook) into the paint and then kicked it out to laugh as Perkins tried to close out a spot up shooter 15-20 ft away.

    LeBron was clearly the MVP of that finals. But I still think that without Bosh and Battier, that team doesn't even come close to winning. I know a lot of people talk down to Bosh, mainly because he doesn't score much. But what he does on D, and his ability to space out the offense is really the key to Spoelstra's system. A lot of their set offensive plays revolve around creating mid range shots for Bosh. Wade and LBJ are both Iso players, Bosh is the key in a set half court. And Battier has just been an absolute workhorse. His defense was critical. The absurd shooting won games.

    If I was in Scott Brooks' shoes, the one adjustment I would have made going into game 2 was to copy Boston's approach and double team Wade around the 20ft mark. He is so prone to taking circus shots when he gets double teamed that it could have really put a blip in their offensive flow. And I will give credit to Boston for that one - they recognised that double teaming LBJ is kind of hopeless. You just accept that he adds roughly 45-50 points a game through assists and buckets, hope to contain him on the perimeter, and take the steam away from the second scoring option.

    As a side note, I don't particularly like the Big 3 model which has been floating around for the past 10-15 years. I much prefer Indiana's/Denvers model of just building a solid team with depth. I'm also a lot higher of defensive stars than I am on offensive stars. The reality is that the new CBA is going to hurt teams. But players like Wade and LBJ don't need to care about their salary from the NBA. In the scheme of things, it is probably only a smaller part of their total income. If that team wins next year, I could see LBJ taking a pay cut to stay there. The money isn't really important to him anymore, but winning is. Cut 10 million from Wade/LBJ and say good bye to Miller et al and all of a sudden Miami has enough space to sign really decent role players. I was joking with my friend that they will invite Dwight Howard to Miami and supplement his salary with their own money. And then I thought, if I was LBJ, that is exactly what I would do.

    "Hey Dwight, you earn $50 mil a year from Adidas and others, come sign an MLE in Miami, Ill give you another $5 mil a year out of my own pocket, and lets win back to back to back to back to back to back."

    As for the quote, OKC is in a lot of trouble. Westbrook and Durant and looking at max contracts, and Harden is worth every penny of it. Ibaka deserves a raise and Perkins already costs lots of money. They need to pick and choose who they keep because they could be in a worse situation in 18 months time.
     
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