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Discussion in 'Pistons and Basketball Articles' started by G-man, Mar 3, 2006.
Now that is al hoot. On his worst day Tay will outplay Delfino.
Better not let guys like Lee, 16 Farms, Bball jay, Lazyberbs and G-Rap Dave see this. I'm sure they'll tell us that Bill Lambier (the real one) don't know what he's talking about. Just goes to show that great minds think alike!
Good post Jam and Hat. I was thinking of doing something like that.
Great points J. For sake of argument (you know how it gets between games), I'll take issue with some of your points. jammertime I ain't buying this. What did LB do besides try to teach the kid to play inside out? If DMC was not emotionally ready for the NBA he should have stayed home another year. But it LOOKS LIKE the promise of big bucks was irresistable to him. Maybe that's his father's fault? Certainly LB ain't in the business of baby-ing wanna-be NBA players. Especially on a contender. Not sure I buy this completely either. DMC did nada with the chances he got. He felt "opportunity time" was beneath him. Joe is on record saying PT had to be earned. Not one...but TWO well respected coaches felt it was better to sit him....given his attitude. Having said that, it seems that both coaches could have found more opportunities to use him. But if the kid ain't serious, why bother. What does that say to the rest of the players on the bench who play (and practice) like they WANT IT....all the time? I'm hard pressed to find a case where he "performed well" except maybe the Atlanta game what, a year ago. I suspect after the games where he "performed well" he followed up with a lackluster practice, as was reported. Sounds like that ones on Darko. Truer words ain't never been spoken. I'm tryin to stay focused on the Pistons, but I can't seem to escape the Darko vortex. Maybe it's cause I don't like folk STEALING money from us.
i've pretty much stated my thoughts about darko in various other threads. simply put, he didn't belong in a pistons uniform, and joe rightly shipped him outta town.
darko shaved his head while he was still a piston so your smoken gun arguement does not hold up at all. under your rfa logic he has no more and no less insentive to play well in orlando then he did in detroit he could of signed with the top bider as an rfa with the pistons and he can still sign with the top bider when he now becomes an rfa with the magic. the stealen money arguement also does not hold any water with me i just do not see evedence that darko doged it as you claim. quiet the contrery i think he played very well when given the mineskule oppertunidy he was given. darko did well in his only two nba starts last year he did well in preseason this year he did well in at least a few garbage time games such as one agenst the nicks he did well in practise. people i will say it again he played 553 minites total in more than two and a half seasens andrew bogut played about three times that in about half a seasen this year. no way that darko doged it so badly that he deserved only 553 minites in two and a half seasens. i think he got shafted large he wanted to play in detroit and did not get a chance. he got that chance in orlando and is now playen well it is as simple as that with me.
Look dude, I'm working class. My relatives are working class. That's not to say that we haven't done well financially, but everyone in my family understands the concept of rolling up your sleeves and going to work. The entire argument G-man made is based upon the understanding that with a paycheck, there comes a responsibility to fulfill the job. To give a consistent and honest effort. It's pretty much the foundation of Detroit basketball. You don't gripe about minutes, you don't gripe about pay. You accept your role so the team can win. I'm kinda worn out on this, but the whole "Darko was in a gulag", "Darko was treated poorly in Detroit" thing wears on me. The Pistons treat their players and staff like family. That's why LB got tossed. That's why Carlisle got tossed. They were the Grumpy Uncles who touched the secretaries hineys in an inappropriate manner or got caught in a lie. Every player in Detroit is a character guy. There are no malcontents. I've seen tape of practices, and Joe is down there yukking it up with the guys and things seem very loose and friendly. If you're not willing to accept that DMC tanked, then understand the Pistons did not tank on him either. He still got paid. He still got a ring. He was still on the playoff roster. He got late season starts over Elden Campbell (who could have used the opportunity for playoff conditioning). I'm a lifelong Pistons fan. You won't catch me posting on a Knicks board about Alan Houston. Or a Magic board about Grant Hill. I'm not saying that people who do that are not fans, but my loyalty to the Pistons is absolute. Even when they are wrong, they're still my team. I don't think they were wrong here. It was a difficult situation, but they handled it (within the big picture) as well as any other franchise might have. So when you say Darko got shafted, consider how G-man or I feel as Pistons fans who watched our #2 overall, once in a lifetime opportunity pick in an insanely deep draft languish. Everyone got hosed on this outcome except Darko. At the very least as a Darko fan, you should appreciate that Joe did right by your boy. He could have traded him next year. He could have screwed him out of a year of significant playing time on a non-contender. He didn't. Because Joe is all class.
i like joe d i think he is a respectible person. i think it is the evil larry and flip that are the primary sorces of fault here. ok anyway we are going definately going in circles so let me pose a couple of questions to you. let us assume that darko did tank in detroit. why is he not tanken now in orlando? the rfa arguement is not convincing to me for the reason i mentioned in my last post. if darko had not tanked in detroit would he have played many more minites? how would you have prefered the last 2.5 seasens to have unfolded? with darko tryen realy hard but still sitten on the bench the whole time?
(ughhhhhhhh... sucked in to Darko vortex) I'm not presuming to answer for Microwave but my answer to your last question is: I would have wanted to see Darko trying hard the whole time, every time, all the time and as a result of his hard work, TAKING minutes from Dice. Force them to play you. Don't take any time as garbage time or an insult. Show a regional or national audience that these coaches are dimwits for not playing you. While I appreciate the balanced contributions to this thread, like MotownPride's, I come down on the side of Gman's well written article. Screw Darko. Detroit did not give up on Darko, Darko gave up on Detroit.
I think the pistons mishandled this from the very beginning. Sure darko was awesome in drills. But this isn't the 90's where you can lock in a rookie. You got 4 years. The pistons really needed someone who could make an immediate impact. I felt like detroit wanted the best of both worlds. They didn't need a lottery pick now but could have used one later so they got a kid who was too young and needed to mature. Even if darko had PT and was great could the pistons even hold him? He was the wrong guy. What i don't get is that you have a winning environment that is doing something special. If the team was struggling, I could see getting real frustrated. The pistons added darko to help their team. Darko came to the pistons looking to help his career. The talk about darko helping this team right now is moot. He didn't want to help this team. He may be filling the stat sheet in orlando but he's not contributing to actually winning
Mad Hatter I guess my blame handout is based on hindsight specific to Darko rather than as a hard and fast rule for everyone. I do agree with you that PT should be earned, not given based on when you were drafted or how much you make. LB is a hard %%%%% coach. He's known to be very tough on rookies. Right or wrong, that approach doesn't always work with every rookie. You have to be able to adapt your management style to the individual. Some people respond well to being yelled at or being called out publicly. Some don't. Darko was obviously one of the don'ts. My main point was just that there was plenty of blame to go around. I don't blame it all on 1 person. But hopefully, everyone involved has learned from their mistakes and can move on. We have several young players with the dreaded P word (potential), and I'd just like to see them reach that potential while in a Piston's jersey rather than someone else's.
jammertime I hear ya Jammertime. I would say Joe "blew it" with that draft choice. I ain't mad at him though. He fell for the hype hook, line and sinker just like the rest of us. That 07 draft pick will make it all better. :fingerscr So would I. Seems like that won't be a problem with Acker and Amir. They ain't got no problem with PT any way they can get it. I'm a little worried about J-Max long term though. Maybe he can be sucessful as a 4, but I'm hoping he works on his lateral movement and makes a splash at the 3. :fingerscr
Exactly. Don't rest on that pick guys. Thats the essential part of this trade and it does merit some patience. When I read about the Orlando GM talking about rebuilding, cutting payroll for future FA's and youth movements it historically has not translated into too many wins. Lets just hope we can catch them somewhere in the 6-10 range next season before ( and if ) they get decent again. And if you want something to kill time inbetween we still have a team left that is not too bad about to start another post season run.
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