Discussion in '2006 Playoffs' started by roscoe36, May 24, 2006.
you r so right, KG...just look at the 2004 NBA Finals...BEn and LB vs THE WORLD!!!
How about that game from Ben? He's back. He was scoring, passing, taking charges, holding his ground against Shaq, etc. What a great leader.
But at the end of the day, I just have to mention the refing. I don't think that there is a conspiracy, but that was god awful. Whoever here posted that the Heat are playing like the 80's Knicks was right on. If the refs allowed us to turn up the physicality like that we'd be holding teams in the 50's every time. How many times can Shaq hit Ben in the face in one series? 15-20? Elbow, Shoulder, hand, headbutt. The combination of Ron Garretson and Ba'Vetta was brutal.
The NBA has to be the most stressful pro sport to watch because of the inconsistency of the calls.
And Dice needs to make his chip ins and FT's too. He was killin' me.
Final thoughts... crazy stats
Pistons 33-75 FG; 20-27 FT, 6-22 3ptFG, TO's 19; points in the paint 38, 39 tot brds
Heat 31-73 FG; 20-23 FT, 6-22 3ptFG, TO's 19; points in the paint 40, 40 tot brds
Of course most of these stats didn't even out until the last 5 mins of the game.
Final crazy stat: Heat score 12 points in first 12 minutes and 17 points in the last 1:46 ??
Stars by quarters: Ben was da man in the first 6 mins and Rip took over iand led us to the halftime lead as he had 20 points...but only 2 in the second half though??. Prince provided scoring and rebounding in that second qtr too.
Third qtr was more Prince and then CB got into the act, with some help from Sheed. In the 4th we started to rely to much on Prince, but Sheed and CB helped out and we were able to hold on with some clutch shooting in the end despite our defensive lapses and ref calls. We got to remember the refs call fouls for the aggresive teams and against the whiners.
The Heat were scoring at a pace that would have given them 466 points in the game during that 1:46!
That would have been embarrasing on national TV. Heat 466, Pistons 92.
You know, Flip has been having Tay work on his one on one skills all season, right in the games. Rip to to an extent. Both have quickness and length that should make them pretty darn good one on one players. Yes, its the playoffs, and what you are is what you are pretty much at this point. Still, it could not hurt at all if after we win this series both Tay and Rip are doing a little better at one on one. One more series to go after this one, and all the weapons he can develop just might be needed.
A more entertaining game than I'd have expected. Quick rundown:
Billups - was solid. Started to get his own scoring going, and looked much better running the offense. Was not a defensive liability.
Rip - was solid. The offense reintroduces his off-ball movement, and look what happens. Improved defense from Game 1, too.
Tay - was solid. Did the garbage work; really impressive on the boards; still no jumpshot. Defense still questionable but much improved.
Dice - was intimidated by Zo.
Sheed - was not intimidated by Zo.
Ben - phenomenal.
Lindsey - had some brilliant, classic stretches on defense, and some horrible stretches on offense. Gets the game ball for getting a stop in the final two minutes without being called for a foul.
Delfino - needs to take more pride in setting screens.
Davis - very good.
Delk - he played?
Knick Bavetta - needs to follow in the footsteps of Karl Malone and Greg Ostertag. And please, take GP with you before he makes even more of a mockery of his legacy.
I would have loved to finish strong. however having W is the most importnat. so let us look for getting the home court back.
The refs have to do a better job in calling the offensive fouls. Not to mention all, at least the ones related to having feet inside the line. They should not give superstars so much edge. Wade hit CB real hard towards the end of the game.
now, if we want to win the series, we really really want CB scoring. He was scoreless for the first half. This is not CB that i know. 3's should fall again, and more and ones are needed.
we did a better job on sharing the ball so we got a big lead. maybe at the end we started saving energy so we went into isolation. i don't want us to go back to ISO again. this is not pistons. i hope we see 25+ assists in game 3 so that we can get the court advantage again.
Bavetta vs. Tayshaun
The late sequence with CB getting mauled, then the missed timeout, and CB getting thrown into the stands by Gary Payton (no foul).
All courtesy the Prince of Senility, Richard B.
It's so much better when ben gets passed to. I don't care if he's fouled because it forces the other team to gaurd him. I especially don't mind Ben getting fouled when it usually will be a foul on Shaq. Tay was great and so was Rip. Sheed is still hobbling but he had some big shots. Chauncey is missing shots he usually makes but in the 3rd quarter he was trying to get "himself" back. We hounded Wade and made him have 9 turnovers as well.
and a special diapersucker moment with Dwyane Wade whining that the Pistons didn't show the Heat respect for winning Game 1.
Great that the team won- only one victory in Florida would be great.
what do you guys think why did Fino finally play 8 minutes? Was great to see him on court.
Wade had 9 TO's
All the guys who want Ben to be involved on the other end seem to be right, at least for the last game. Just imagine how dangerous the team would be with a real offensive threat at the 5 spot... and I'm not talking about a scorer, but about someone who can score about 12-15ppg with an acceptable FG%.
RIP was huge in the first half and disappeared in the 2nd- hopefully he can be more consistent.
Kgrag, you're 400% right, while watching Ben's play, I could only shook my head and was like "Wow ! what a great leader."
Ben, Tay and LH were the main reason we had this win. What would happened if LH had failed to make the final steal.
In game 1, I did a check of the game flow and play by play and saw that Miami beat us 42-4 over a total of 12:36 (composed of 4 different runs) and that we beat them 82-49 over the remaining 35:24.
For game 2, the time disparity is even more glarity: Miami beat us 29-13 during two stretches (the final 1:46 obviously, plus a stretch from 10:19 in the 4th to 3:26 in the 4th) that total 8:39. While the Pistons beat Miami 81-61 during the remaining 39:21.
So now, over the first two games, Miami wins 71-17 over 21:15; and we win 163-110 over 74:45.
Now, in game 2, during the 8:39 of the game (really, of the 4th quarter) where they were killing us, we had 23 possessions (i counted an off reb as starting a new possession); on those 23 possessions we got:
-4 field goals (2 tay put backs, 1 tay lay up, and 1 chauncey lay up) on 13 attempts,
-5-6 FT's. (I broke these possessions down into a table, so if anybody is interested, let me know).
What's really striking is how long most of the possessions were. If I exclude from the list of possessions tay's 2 put-backs and the 3 quick-foul possessions that resulted in our free throws, we've still got 18 possessions:
Out of those 18 possessions:
-2 field-goals on 11 attempts,
-7 TO's. And of those 18 possessions,
-10 of the 18 possessions took 19 or more seconds off the shot clock. Now, if we are whipping the ball around the perimeter and making beautiful cuts for layups or wide-open triples at the shot clock buzzer i'm all for it. But we all saw what was happening for those long possessions seconds: for the first 8 to 10 seconds, chauncey pounds the ball to get it over the wing, for the remaining 14 to 16 seconds, tay pounds the ball while backing down. meanwhile, ben, rip and sheed stand perfectly still on the weakside and chauncey kind of floats out to the top of the arc. it's a miracle tay could get shots off at all with so little movement around him and we're lucky he was able to get the put backs he did. for this i fault the players, who were just trying to run clock and flip for not calling the time out that would get them running their offense again and playing to crush rather than not to lose. and it was a shame, because miami, especially in the first bad stretch in the 4th quarter, gave us plenty of opportunities with their own turnovers and bad shots.
anyway, sorry to get so anal in breaking this down (i guess it was kinda lock staring at a bad car wreck). i guess my real point is two fold:
1) on the down side, playing not-to-lose we stopped moving on offense and our efficiency and production went way way down and defensively we let them play the short-burst offensive game
2) on the plus side, as in game 1, but better and with better results, we showed we can beat miami handily and steadily over long periods of time and, in this game, those long periods were mostly very very good, with higher assists, higher assist-to-turnover ratio, better and more balanced shooting, and better defense, especially on miami's supporting cast, but also I would say, on shaq and wade (though they obviously got theirs).
I don't think we were complacent during those bad stretches, I think we tightened up. I'm hoping that the players upon reviewing film of the game recognize the striking difference between the unselfish up-tempo intelligent detroit basketball they played to slowly build an 18 point lead and the foolish, stagnant, 1 on 1 pound the ball game they played to piss it away. the contrast couldn't be plainer, more stark, or more obvious.
but all in all, for me at least, there was much more to be encouraged by than discouraged by in last night's game. i feel that we are slowly putting things back together -- as though a piece gets added back with each game.
Dialing Sheed long distance...
This is a response to Roscoes's PM about Sheed for discussion...
No problem with shooting the 3's... as long as there's some balance...
The value of getting easy put backs when he's doubled down low ... or getting the Heat in the penalty... just doesn't happen from 20' out.
Of course you know the effects of long rebs going the other way.
Then you add in the passes out of the post for easy looks.
What bothers me is that he's not even trying to get inside position...
I'll concede that there's some legitimacy to the ankle making it difficult to fight for position... but if there's any big advantage we have it's Sheed against Walker /Haslem down low.... we need to capitalize.
That said, I think it's good strategy to nail a couple from deep early to open things up....
Sheed taking Zo outside makes a lot of sense...
balance my friend...balance.
Great game flow analysis, prof. It really was irritating to see all the standing around in the 4th quarter, after the ball movement and cutting had been so good for most of the first 3.
Rob Parker is REALLY talking some smack today in his column:
Wish I could say I shared his confidence...let's hope it plays out that way.
From Drew Sharp's column this morning (this is for all the people who don't want to involve Ben in the offense):
"Wallace's improved offensive aggressiveness warranted enough defensive attention that it provided Hamilton a touch more breathing room. And sometimes, that's all you need to get out of a shooting funk."
Game Chat excerpts
mercury LH is in Wades head
Dumars4Ever wow, delfino's in!
professor oh my
Hotsauce flip is adjusting...finally
aurorakmw it is so nice to see the bench in this game
roscoe36 geezus, Flip is playing everyone!@!!!!
LA Dre flip already played 10 players...Joe must have got on him
BROTHER HQ margarita time!!
LA Dre We are on pace for 100... a good sign...
Dumars4Ever what a great steal by lindsey...that was beautiful
professor classic lindsey
adonis this is Pistons game
LA Dre dunk
FreshPrince22 Big Ben!
roscoe36 Ben doing it all
Ozarkruffrider OH YEAH!!!
mercury Where's bbaljay?
BROTHER HQ BONGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG
Buckeyes#1 i bet arroyo is missing this
Zoso I'm glad to see Delfino and Davis play it's about time too
BillLaimbeer I can say ass in here, Roscoe?
roscoe36 ass (testing)
roscoe36 just dont call anyone an ass
TWOTIMESRALPHI finally a word thats not censored- ASS
roscoe36 anyone in here
BROTHER HQ maya chs dee dada ...hoopa hoopa
armygirl Not a CB hater...No Sirrrrrrrr, just a Pistons Lover
FreshPrince22 What a pass from Ben!
adonis oneal is hurt
Hotsauce SHAQ hurt
mercury Howard Cosell...Shaq is Down!...Shaq is Down...down goes Shaq
BROTHER HQ he hit Walkers leg
Dumars4Ever no idea what happened to shaq there
BROTHER HQ jammed neck
BillLaimbeer yup, HQ
adonis this is a stupid act to get a minute rest
Buckeyes#1 shaq is a pain in the neck
DarthTater Now they can have an excuse for losing
BillLaimbeer not anymore, buckeyes
roscoe36 ALL HIS FAT RUSHED TO HIS HEAD
adonis i like this one roscoe
detteam lol 36
DarthTater Nah, it would have exploded if that happened
BillLaimbeer No excuses...new Heat motto
(Early) LA Dre If we get 20 from Sheed we win...
(Late) LA Dre That is 16 for Sheed. he should go inside now and get those next 4 to get to the magic # of 20
Dumars4Ever HOW DID THEY NOT GIVE HIM THE TIMEOUT!!!!!
Dumars4Ever I CAN'T BELIEVE THAT!!!!!
professor wow, they are robbing us
Zoso unbelievable ripoff job
professor they are brutalizing chauncey on the inbounds
adonis ok go for to
aurorakmw omg how is this possible
Ozarkruffrider what a crap call
Dumars4Ever bavetta raped us, but there is NO WAY this should have been this close
BillLaimbeer Bevetta fell asleep on that one
roscoe36 SHADES OF 87
mercury they'll double Chauncey... get it to Rip
Tally What a f'ing ripoff from the officials. This is the worst officiating I've ever seen
BROTHER HQ richard freekin Bevetta
Dumars4Ever 17 pts in the last 1:37 for miami??? unbelievable!
Zoso Richard Bavetta trying to give the game to Miami for or what?????
Tally Bevetta has been at the center of five very bad calls
Dumars4Ever thankfully chauncey got the call when he got mugged 1000 times
professor what i don't like is that fouls to keep chauncey from breaking free in thefirst place
Dumars4Ever lindsey on the STEAL
Dumars4Ever F YOU WADE
Ozarkruffrider GAME BABY
professor oh wade thought he was fouled -- poor baby
BillLaimbeer I almost said "why is Lindsey in the game?"
roscoe36 good game everyone
Dumars4Ever clean strip!
BillLaimbeer Lindsey hammered him
And The Low posted something about (positive) Flip, but I won't share it. Consider him still a sour apple. :D
Oh, I didn't realize the chats were being logged now...LOL...pretty funny to read some of that stuff well after the heat of the moment.
New post-game tradition, roscoe? Game chat highlights?
You silly man. When you log in, it clearly notifies you all chats are logged! ;)
When I have time, I will do it. Post game, I have to record the interviews, catch the radio show, update the graphics, rip video and audio etc.
If someone would be interested in picking through the log for nuggets, I would be happy to provide it and they can put together the chat summary. Many hands make for light work.
Separate names with a comma.