Away Orlando Magic Wednesday Nov 21 2012

Discussion in 'November 2012' started by roscoe36, Oct 29, 2012.

  1. Walter

    Walter All-Star Forum Donor

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    We scored less in the entire second half than we did the 1st quarter. Much to my dismay, I started watching at halftime. The Pistons couldn't get anything going. Nobody on the team seemed to try, or care. It was down right embarrassing.

    They couldn't stop an 8 year old girl. There's nothing the coach can do if Orlando can repeatedly score easy layups on 1-on-3 fastbreaks. Traffic cones would've done a better job defending the paint. The only player that attempted to play defense was Drummond.

    CV got some burn and it was just as horrid as I remembered. Stuckey was also painful to watch.

    We really don't have any point guards on this team. We just have a bunch of combo guards who can't shoot.

    The thing that worries me the most is Monroe's turning into a large Carmelo Anthony. He gets his numbers but it doesn't really help his team win.
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  2. copper

    copper Bench Warmer

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    Monroe has been a willing passer walt, much like Bk he cant help it if when he passes his teammates cant make the shot, or refuse to shoot. Coach needs to put shooters in...
  3. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    I picked a good game to miss. Looks like a frustrating one.
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  4. bricalz

    bricalz First Round Draft Pick

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    I respectfully disagree with the blame game on the coach. While I think that there are more things to be desired with regards to in-game adjustments, I think he has been doing a decent job. These losses haven't been totally losses from beginning to end. Most of them have been lost in a quarter and this one was not an exception (and a horrid third it was).

    It's still early in the season and still early in this team's development. Jeez, Knight is a PG in this league. He isn't quite there yet. Monroe is gonna be OK. Max is doing his thing. Prince can still lead. There is also still a salvageable role for Maggette on this team.

    Stuckey needs the ball in his hands and even he hasn't quite figured himself out yet. He is not a respectable outside shooter no matter what the numbers indicate, but, English or Middleton won't be the complete solution to that. So unless he becomes the next Ray Allen, English or Middleton will stay on the bench. Give the coach some leeway here. He recognized that Singler was a good fit for the starting lineup with he shows in practice, so he should recognize if English or Middleton would be good enough to play over Stuckey.

    Drummond and Monroe will eventually play together. They are already wreaking havoc in my 2K13 team so, it would only be a matter of time before they end up playing alongside each other.

    Agenda? C'mon. What agenda?
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  5. alexa032

    alexa032 Team Captain

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    While this loss wasn't all on coach, Tayshaun had a point when he said coach needed to make a decision sooner - and not the coach version of a kiddie tantrum (subbing all five starters out at the same time; counterproductive!) - he needed to look at what was wrong and make an adjustment/sub someone in who could've helped, not sub in a whole new unit (one that had previously lost all of a 10 point lead). It's what a good coach would do. I mean, I understand being angry, but fans can be angry and not affect the outcome, a coach can let his emotions get the better of him and lose the game, then in the long run, his team.

    A coach's job is to look at his roster and find combinations of players whose skillsets complement one another. It's hard to not put at least part of the blame on him because he's the guy who decides who to play and when - and we've lost games because of those decisions (OKC, ORL twice, Houston). No, we haven't lost games from tip off like we did early last year, we're losing because of bad quarters - a result of not adjusting when, like Brooks/Vaughn did, starters from the opposing team come in earlier and go against our bench who, especially in the OKC game at home, were no match. Bynum vs. Westbrook? Durant vs. JJ? Even worse, Big Baby vs. JJ. It's an easy thing to recognize and correct, but coach seems too stubborn to change.
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  6. copper

    copper Bench Warmer

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  7. Ernie the Slow Adult

    Ernie the Slow Adult All-Star Forum Donor

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    http://www.detroitnews.com/article/20121121/SPORTS0102/211210432#ixzz2CxdvIqVg
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  8. TheeTFD

    TheeTFD All-Star

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    I liked the effort of your post Lee but how can I like it ? There's nothing there to like.
    No one likes hearing about how sad our team played.
    I was listening to the game and was all excited as we controled the 1st half. But the 3rd Q with a 21 pt swing !
    Surely Frank isn't quiting. He does know to win/coach ? He likes the money and where he is ?
  9. lapiston

    lapiston Team Captain

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    If we take a broad view of it, what combination of Piston guards will give the team NBA production at least 2 out of 3 nights?

    Knight would not start on any NBA team today. He is not ready for prime time and I do hope he will turn out to be good. But his lack of progress from last year is worrisome. His minutes need to be cut so he can re-group. Real talent shows up most of the time immediately--case in point: Drummond and Singler. I am a bit worried about Knight at the present.

    Bynum would not make most rosters in this league. Enough said.

    Stuckey is Stuckey. Enough said.

    There is no one on the roster who can run the team, hit a three on the run, make a steal or get into the lane and create havoc or force a double team or just plain be counted on to make a shot.

    There is no one on the roster who can or is willing to step up in crunch time, or stop a bad streak. Monroe will be a good player but he is not at a stage where he can guarantee points. I think he will be a scoring machine but not there yet.

    Most teams would get guard help. But looks like the Pistons want to draft a guard in the top 5 or a scorer. Regardless of how Knight turns out, this might be the idea. It is a guard oriented league and it is hard to win games with a trio of sub-standard NBA guards.

    I would start Stuckey at point and play him to get value and then trade him. I would play Drummond a lot and work on being a defensive team. Muck up the games with defense. No, Drummond is not ready to help the Pistons win a bunch of games but he is the future at center.
  10. copper

    copper Bench Warmer

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    English can shoot and can hit the long ball with consistency lap. At this point...and it seems the team is ready to revolt on Frank, he should give the youngsters some burn...whats the worst that can happen? lose? already got that taken care of. Lets build for the future, and the future is our youngsters. get them out there and if we lose? lets lose while gaining them some experience, rather then losing while our vets get the burn and our youngsters come in to a huge defecit and try to fix someone elses mistake. Tay has had a few coaches , and he is doubting whether the coach knows what hes doing ...that should send red flags flying to all the people on the forum that think Frank knows what hes doing.
  11. BallDon'tLie

    BallDon'tLie All-Star 3x Fantasy Champion

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  12. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    Coaches and players shouldn't use the media to resolve issues in the game. It's a chickencrap move by Tay even if he is right.

    This is just one bad loss. I am thrilled we beat Boston, but I never considered that somehow we instantly became a playoff team.

    If Frank doesn't start winning some games, he will be fired. Anyone who thinks he has an agenda that doesn't include keeping his job needs to give that a second think. Projecting motivations onto people most of us have never met rarely turns out good.
  13. copper

    copper Bench Warmer

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    I dont think he has an agenda perse...I have always said I think he is a bad coach...he lacks the ability to make in game changes and set up anything resembling a play out of a timeout. He had J kidd, VC and J rich in Jersey and they are what I think he was gauged on and they made him look wayyyy better than he actually is. He just seems like he either doesnt know how to get the most out of a lineup by putting groups of players together that can actually make the others better. Or he is too stubborn to admit faults and make changes when they need to be made. Either way, he has to be running on a short leash and hopefully the thought of a player revolt or loss of his job will persuade him to use better rotations and swallow whatever stubborn settups he has in his mind.
  14. Mogilny

    Mogilny All-Star Forum Donor

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    The Pistons provided some comedy gold in the third quarter.
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  15. lapiston

    lapiston Team Captain

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    I am not against giving English some burn. But English also doesn't have experience and he wasn't drafted as a top, top prospect. So I wonder about his upside. But it just looks like given the guard situation, the team will lose a bunch. The organization must either get a major free agent in by next year or draft a top, top guard or a big time scorer in the top five of the draft, whether or not Knight steps up and even if English becomes a surprise.
  16. copper

    copper Bench Warmer

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    englishg doesnt have experience? what experience does Stuck have? losing ...At least English upgrades a big flaw in our offense...the ability to shoot. He also plays defense which neither of our current sg's seem to want to do. The organization needs to give the young kids a run instead of bringing in aother veteran that will keep them on the bench.
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  17. Lee356

    Lee356 All-Star

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    You don't have to meet someone. You can listen to what others say about him, and observe from his behaviors in front of you whether they make sense. Frank does not listen to anyone. If he makes a decision, no matter how wrong, there is no amount of evidence nor persuasion to get him off from his set course. Believe it or not, that what is said of him - and that is what I am seeing.
  18. del

    del Bench Warmer Forum Donor

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    I agree with what Tay said, but also agree with this statement. It ends up with another Kuester situation. And Tay being the captain of the team makes it even worse as it will instil bad behaviour in the young core.


    Agree again. Do not understand everyone on here saying he doesn't want to win. His job rests on winning. Based on some of his actions thus far this season though, I just have to go with the other statement people keep making - he just isn't a good coach.

    Yes all the players were bad tonight, but that third quarter was as bad, if not worse, than what Kuester would put together. Frank took waaaaay too long to make any changes, and then to do a 5 man sub just showed his emotion is getting the better of him, rather than taking thought out decisions. He apparently preaches defence, so how about playing the two guys on the team that have consistently shown they are active and willing defenders to help at least lock down one end - Singler and English. Oh, and what? They can both shoot?

    Frank took some time to work out the rotations last season, finally put JJ at SF and started Knight, but he did not have the benefit of pre-season training. This year there is no excuse. If he doesn't make rotation changes (that do not include BoT or Daye) soon, then I will be calling for his head. If the losses keep coming and no changes are made, we will see said head rolling across the Palace floor regardless.

    I never expected us to become a great team overnight, but I did expect us to play harder, faster and better than last season and actually win games against other teams that suck. Unfortunately we suck more than those sucky teams.

    This sucks.
  19. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    The thing is even if you had the two greatest coaches going head to head, one has to necessarily lose. There are no ties in basketball.

    I think people read too much into wins and losses. It's important we play well. We played well against Boston. We played terribly against Orlando. Part of playing includes coaching.

    What irks me about Tay, is that players win games. You would never have seen Isiah Thomas or Joe Dumars blame a coach for a loss. Great players are accountable.
  20. copper

    copper Bench Warmer

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    yes roscoe, a coach wins and a coach loses..but that is where it ends, Frank didnt just lose? he got outcoached and lost his marbles and his players by the sounds of Tays statement and the players body language. A coach is supposed to put his team in the best possible position to win games, and develope players....well Im not sure if he is developing the players but I am sure he isnt doing the first part.

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