NY Nicks Nov 21 8pm

Discussion in 'November 2007' started by max, Nov 19, 2007.

  1. Lee356

    Lee356 All-Star

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    Well, slow night on the boards. Not a whole lot of posts on the game. Thanks for the few who did take the time to post their thoughts. Thanksgiving and all. Hope everyone is having a good holiday so far.


    Mohammed had a role in this game. He helped check Curry in the 2nd half where otherwise the guy was out of control. I kind of thought it was wrong though to keep him in the game after Curry came out. He picked up two fouls while Curry was out of the game. JMAX had some success guarding Curry in the 2nd half also.


    NY chose not to guard Dyess, and Dyess had a field day shooting. Billups had a whole lot of assists to McDyess, and ended up with 14 for the game along with 20 points. And I don't think he ended up having even one turnover.


    Rip did not do a whole lot. But hey, our starters rocked, so you can't complain too much about his game.


    Tay was on fire thruout the game on his outside shooting.


    Amir got to play some in the first half, but Saunders chose to pick on him by taking him out quick when things were not going well. But note, we still had a nine point lead when Amir came out. Amir had just gotten an offensive rebound putback just prior to coming out of the game.


    Afflalo was also victimized in the first half. He got inside, was goal tended, and poof, taken out of the game after making one of two. These happened to be the only times we scored for a long stretch. But Afflalo got a 2nd chance in the 2nd half. He came on early for Rip in the 3rd quarter, and stayed out there well into the 4th quarter while the Pistons took pretty much complete control of the game. Note, Afflalo was guarding their shooting guard during this stretch - see below.


    What happened after Afflalo came out in the 2nd quarter was ugly. That left Murray to try to guard their point guard. Afflalo was doing the job before that, with Murray of course getting the easier job following the shooting guard. The last of our lead evaporated as NY got past Murray like he was not there. The throw - a - way by Murray did not help either when we were still up by 9. Yeah, and Flip tried to run Flip Murray at point some more in the 2nd half after the game seemed to be well in hand. That big lead did not seem so big with Murray in the game pretending to be a point guard. Billups came back in rather fast.


    Maxiell was also in their as we did just fine at the end of the 3rd and beginning of the 4th quarters. JMAX did not get his first foul for the game until the 2nd half of this one.


    JMAX missed some shots from the outside. Guess what, you got to practice shots in the game. Jason can hit those. One of Jason's highlights was a dunk off a nice feed by Murray. Otherwise, just tough inside D.


    Samb did not play.


    Sheed knocked down a pair of threes in the first quarter. Foul trouble kept him playing a whole lot. He is not a good matchup on Curry or Randolph defensively, one too big, one too quick. But on the other hand, Sheed can hit those threes, and they don't gaurd him. Between him and Dyess, we had two guys who could pretty much choose between them who took an open shot.


    Dyess did do one post move. A drive to the middle and a score from the left.


    We had a lot of scoring in the paint, even though it did not seem like it. At one point, despite all those baskets by Curry inside in the 1st half, we were way ahead of NY on paint scoring. Basically, we had just a bit here and there from several players.


    GO PISTONS!!!!!

    Comments after reading the boxscore. I will add that Sheed was not in foul trouble. I must have missed that he got injured. Come to think of it, I still have not watched the first two minutes of the 2nd half.

    I forgot to mention Hayes. He only played 10 minutes, as Tay played all 38 of his minutes at small forward and Maxiell was taking up all the backup power forward minutes. Hayes, on a broken play, gathered the ball in and took it to the rack and scored - his only shot of the night. He was in the 2nd quarter as the team did badly. I won't say he did anything in particular wrong. Just in the wrong place at the wrong time I guess. I did like that he tended to play toward the basket on offense.


    On minutes for the young guys. Afflalo got 16 minutes in this game, not bad. Amir only played 5, and this included a bit of garbage time at the end of the game. But considering Mohammed did have to play a lot to check Curry tonight, and Maxiell got lots of minutes, I can't complain too much about that. (As long as its no trend.)
  2. Dlev59

    Dlev59 Bench Warmer Moderator

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    Geez Lee........."the throw a way by Murray", the guy had one TO, Rip had six of the Pistons nine TO`s...no mention of that??
  3. Lee356

    Lee356 All-Star

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    The subject is our meltdown to start the 2nd quarter. Sorry, Rip was not playing during that stretch. He was playing though as we stomped them in the first quarter.
  4. Ernie the Slow Adult

    Ernie the Slow Adult All-Star Forum Donor

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    I don't think you can pin point DET's 2nd quarter meltdown on one player. To me it is Flip's inability to substitute and mix and match his players. He can't take his starters out until the 10 minute mark of the 1st at the earliest. That will be one player more than likely. Tonight he seemed to switch to a zone in both the 1st and 3rd as a way to keep the starters in. When he does take them out he takes them all out and ends up with a group of Flip, AA, Amir, Nazr and Hayes. Between them they have maybe one or two offensive moves and zero chemistry. This group is almost assured of giving a lead back. I believe the 2nd quarter closed with Sheed, Nazr, Rip, Tay and CB. A sub or 2 can play effectively with this unit.
  5. lapiston

    lapiston Team Captain

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    Ernie,

    I agree. Not enough offense with that second unit but they can play with some of the starters as you say.

    The Knicks are bad because of their guard play.
  6. TWOTIMESRALPHI

    TWOTIMESRALPHI Team Captain 3x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    I somehow have the feeling FlipS even doesn't try to find good rotations. All he does is play the starters and let them get a lead- once he feels that lead is big enough, he inserts almost the complete bench and with the first mistake he gets afraid they could blow it up and replaces player by player.
    So he doesn't bring in bench players to provide a spark or something new to the game but only to rest the starters a little bit, which is the wront attitute these days, when teams like Dallas play Terry from the bench or SA Ginobili.
  7. 16 Mile

    16 Mile Bench Warmer

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    Our bench can not play as a unit. Flip needs to learn that. Individually, they play well with the starters, but as a unit, they are too slow, too short, lack a distributor, and play zero D. But they do throw up a lot of shots.

    Positive note, other than Rip's to's, our starters basically toyed with NY. When they were in, the game was never in doubt.
  8. brofmfa

    brofmfa Bench Warmer Forum Donor

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    I don't trust this guy, period, he is just kinda I-play-them-as-per-your-requist, no plan no heart no system no call no nothing just try to pile up wins to add to his resume for next job.
  9. Ozarkruffrider

    Ozarkruffrider First Round Draft Pick

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    Lee, thanx for the review. I don't have the Pass, so only games I get now are national games. Listening to NBA radio, it seems Zeke is in deep doo-doo and we didn't help his cause.
  10. NYPistonFan729

    NYPistonFan729 Bench Warmer Forum Donor

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    Can't stand flip, but you can't blame the rotations on him. Too many injuries to have a consistent second unit. Hopefully, a regular rotation can be established especially during this homestand. Also, Hayes has been battling a cold. The second unit has not worked together enough to establish consistency.
  11. TWOTIMESRALPHI

    TWOTIMESRALPHI Team Captain 3x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    That's the point- I don't think Flip mixes the 2nd unit enough with the starters. AJ for instance would definetely benefit alot from playing along CB and not FlipM. JMax and Sheed or with Samb could be decent, if they play enough along each other. And so on. FlipS would probably be a better icehockey- coach the way he rotates at times :stirthepot:
  12. Warthog

    Warthog Bench Warmer

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    got to the game early to make sure i got the automotion calendar, and was extremely disappointed. after all the complaining the swimsuit calendar, the last 2 years have been subpar - this year it they did all the hair and makeup like it was the 20s or 50s or something old. not impressed.

    anyway, the knicks suck. this game was never in doubt, but flip again tried to make it interesting by putting the whole bench unit in at once in the 2nd quarter. that's the 2nd game in a row where we've blown a comfortable lead because of this. note to flip: this isn't the preseason anymore, start subbing out your starters in the 1st quarter and always make sure you have a couple on the floor with the younger guys.

    flip was interviewed after the game and was asked about this. he said he kept all 5 starters in because they were building a lead (again i don't see how subbing out one at a time in the 1st would hurt that). then he said he may have to always have a couple starters on the floor with the young guys. gee...ya think? at least he recognized it.

    i saw rip with 6 TOs but watching the game live it didn't feel like he was responsible for that many. i'm also disappointed that neither nba.com or espn.com's recap of the game featured maxiell's dunk...did anyone save it by chance? maybe it wasn't as impressive on TV but it sure was impressive live...i thought it was going to contend for dunk of the night.

    not much else to say except good job nazr, and we really, really need stuckey back and playing over murray. new york hardly has quick guards except for robinson, who even afflalo had trouble staying in front of, but man flip was getting burned and seems to get attacked every game when he first comes in. he looked awful.

    hopefully stuckey is dynamic enough of a guard and is good enough to both attack the basket and distribute the ball that our second unit come have some firepower and a true playmaker that can prevent our offense from stagnating when chauncey is not on the floor.

    also, good job to the pistons, assisting on 15 of the 16 made shots in the 1st quarter.
  13. TWOTIMESRALPHI

    TWOTIMESRALPHI Team Captain 3x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    By the way, CB had 10 (!!!) assists in that first quarter- ain't that a new record?
  14. Warthog

    Warthog Bench Warmer

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    isiah's record on the pistons is 11.
  15. dba

    dba All-Star Moderator 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    Agree. Given the way the offense has failed to click without CB on the floor - other than the first couple of games when Prince ran the point some - Stuckey is going to have to be pretty impressive when he gets back. Talk about a trial by fire.
  16. buddahfan

    buddahfan Retired from Forum

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    I doubt that there will be a trial by fire or anything else that smacks of Hollywood.

    Hot Rod will play like a rookie when he is activated. Nothing more and nothing less.

    How good a rookie? Only time will tell.

    Can't undo the draft.

    :hoops:
  17. Slippy

    Slippy All-Star Administrator Forum Donor

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    Its just that it seems as if we're getting farther and farther from that championship contending atmosphere so more and more gets piled on Stuckey to be some kind of catalyst. Like you say, he is a rookie...will probably be good. But will he be able to impact this team this year...it doesn't seem like there's anything else left to look forward to.
  18. LA Dre

    LA Dre All-Star 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    Didn't see the came but good points by all. The mixing of the rotations is the big issue. Playing the starters for 9-12 minutes and then throwing in the bench is not going to work vs good teams. (it didn't work vs some of the bad teams out west either).

    flip has to learn how to play at least 2 bench players with the starters and bring them in at the 7 to 8 minute mark and stop relying them to get the big lead and then seeing it evaporate with his bench playing in there all at once.

    one positive was that they finally stop that streak of allowing teams to score over 100 pts...of course it was the knicks though.... What's with red uniforms for six straight games??? did they lose the others??
  19. Lee356

    Lee356 All-Star

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    One more thing. It would be better still if it were Stuckey, Afflalo, Mejia, JMAX, Amir. Mejia would give the unit more rebounding, far better defense, and an extra ball handler.

    I don't see this as an issue. I believe its more who you play, not whether you mix & match or not. For some reason (like wanting to showcase Flip Murray) the Pistons went completely away from playing Prince at point after proving it works for a few games. I believe a unit of Prince at point, Afflalo, Hayes, JMAX, and Amir would work just fine. When Stuckey gets back in two weeks, again, this same unit will do just fine with Stuckey replacing Prince. PS, Amir could play some small forward early in the first quarter to allow Prince to play point with the 2nd unit.
  20. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    Hog, you're probably too young to appreciate the nostalgia of pin up girls. :)

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