NY Knicks March 11th, 7:30 PM

Discussion in 'March 2009' started by Dlev59, Mar 7, 2009.

  1. LA Dre

    LA Dre All-Star 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    I dunno I was at home watchin NBA TV replays and my own DVR replays and I saw some of the same stuff that Hog saw in real-time live action....The pistons allowed the Knicks to race by for layups and wide open threes and out hustled our guys even though we did grab most of their bricks....

    Even though we were in control of the game most of the way it seem that since we could never stretch that lead out to 15 +, and they were always hanging around so you knew that it would be a battle to the end. Even if we had won in regulation, it would have probably been described as an ugly win

    There were spots in the game where we just looked awful with bad turnovers...you know bad teams can make you look bad as players tend to be lazy or just do dumb things i.e Rip fouling Hughes in the end, Hermann running over Nate on the fastbreak, Max, Stuck and Rip having their obligatory offensive fouls and Amir being clueless for a two minute spell probably just surprised that he was even in the game... :dizzy2:
  2. NYPistonFan729

    NYPistonFan729 Bench Warmer Forum Donor

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    Probably not, but he would be an upgrade over anything we have now coming off the bench.
  3. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    Yeah, I noticed that too. Then he recovered in the next paragraph (i think) to ramble about back injuries.

    OH MAX!

    And even if it goes in, the game is only tied. You definitely do not foul the shooter there. Since the foul was on the follow through, if Hughes had made it, he would have been shooting a free throw to win the game in regulation.
  4. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    He didn't actually try to foul the shooter. It was accidental. Every time we have one of these situations, people say we shouldn't have fouled the shooter. Why would it make sense to challenge shots all the way through the game and not make sense to challenge a shot that we really needed them to miss?

    Also, the shot was an airball that came up short, so doubtful that it was only on the follow through.

    And even in the unlikely event than Hughes makes the 3 while getting fouled, then converts the free throw, we still would have had about a 50% chance of winning the game on the final possession.

    8 times out of 10, Rip challenges that shot without fouling and drastically increases our odds of winning.


    Letting an NBA guard take an uncontested 3-pointer is just not that good of a strategy.
  5. LA Dre

    LA Dre All-Star 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    If we are talking about David Lee then I concur, and deep down inside Joe was probably saying the same thing last night when he recalls that Lee was still on the board when he chose Maxiell at 26 in the 2005 draft...:mad:

    But Joe shouldn't feel too bad, Max is actually better at 26 than some of the all- Americas picked ahead of him who are now all-scrubs like Channing Frey at 8, Ike Diogu at 9, Sean May at 13, and Johan Petro at 25:eyebrows:
  6. Ernie the Slow Adult

    Ernie the Slow Adult All-Star Forum Donor

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    Even one of DET's?

    It is difficult to foul these guys before they can get a shot up, but that doesn't stop people from acting like Curry is a dunce for not doing it.
  7. CloudWalker

    CloudWalker Bench Warmer

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    Is it better than fouling him or isn't it?

    Seriously, we have all seen Richard commit some of the dumbest reach fouls (seemingly) of all time. He doesn't ever prevent the shot, he just swipes at the ball and gives the refs free reign to blow the wistle.

    It's demoralizing for me, and I'm not even on the floor with him.

    I'd hate to be his teammate when he pulls that kind of stuff, be it stupid fouls, or stupid clownish turnovers. He always finds a way to make it rough so he can later declare it right.
  8. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    This is not to pick on Max, but has he really outplayed Ike Diogu and Channing Fry?

    Or is it that our bench is so woeful, he sticks with the team because there is no one to push him down the bench like there are on those other teams?

    After our starting 6, the talent drop off is HUGE. And it's been that way for five years now.
  9. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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  10. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    Actually, since it looks like Diogu is almost out of the league, you have to wonder with Max getting a deal at $4+ million over the next several years, if it would be worth a shot to pick up Diogu for the league minimum.
  11. Walter

    Walter All-Star Forum Donor

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    I've never been a fan of that approach. The other team wants to extend the game. If you foul them early, you're playing into their hands. Instead of trying to launch the 3, they're hitting FTs. Assume they hit both FTs. Now you're up only 1 and you have to inbound the ball. If they get a steal, you may end up down 1. If they don't, they foul you and now the pressure's on you to make your FTs.
  12. Walter

    Walter All-Star Forum Donor

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    Rip's foul is not what cost us this game. His turnovers did. Looking at the box score, we did better than NY in all but 2 categories. One of them is 3pt shooting (11% for us). However, we could've lived with that if it weren't for the TO discrepancy. We had 15 to NY's 3. That's the bottom line. It wasn't Dice being old, it wasn't Herrman not playing defense, it wasn't Max getting into foul trouble, it wasn't Amir etc etc. We just didn't take care of the basketball. Period.
  13. Walter

    Walter All-Star Forum Donor

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    Yeah, but Rip's not good at math.
  14. BillLaimbeer

    BillLaimbeer All-Star 4x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    It really depends on how much time is left. If there are only a few seconds, then you might go for the foul. With lots of time left (20 or more seconds), I agree with you. Just play good defense, and god forbid, don't foul a guy shooting a jump shot, especially a 3-pointer.
  15. Pwn Toney

    Pwn Toney All-Star Forum Donor

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    That's a whole lotta ifs.

    I'd much rather give them a 75% chance at only getting 2 when they need 3.

    Instead of allowing them a 35% chance at the 3 they need or giving them 75% chance at the 3 they need by fouling on the 3pt shot.

    Fouling early was the right move.
  16. raxrets

    raxrets Team Captain

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    that's the price of being in ECF every year.

    ppl are comparing our rooks to opponent's but are forgetting that ours are from 30-50 pick but other team's picks are top 10 or so.
  17. Darth Tater

    Darth Tater All-Star Forum Donor 6x Fantasy Champion

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  18. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    If MC told Rip to let Hughes get off a 3-pointer but to be sure to foul him on the release, then I agree that it probably wasn't the optimal strategy.

    However, letting Hughes take an uncontested shot would have been just about as bad. And you are right, there was too much time to go for the non-shooting foul strategy.

    The correct play is to challenge the shot as hard as possible while taking extra care not to let the offensive player trick you into fouling him. That means that you can't fall for a pump fake, can't have your momentum going toward the player for an after release type foul, etc. I believe Rip was trying to do this, but when he saw the shooting motion of Hughes, he realized that he could challenge the shot without getting drawn into a foul. He just screwed up on the execution by getting a piece of the arm on the release.

    In the same way, an optimal strategy wasn't to have Dyess fumble Stuckey's potentially game winning pass out of bounds. Everyone who's ever played basketball knows that you aren't supposed to fumble passes out of bounds, so what was he thinking? He just screwed up. :frusty:
  19. BallDon'tLie

    BallDon'tLie All-Star 3x Fantasy Champion

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    I'm pickin' up what you're puttin' down my man!

    Why not aggressively go for a steal while Hughes is trying to catch it.
    Best case scenario: Rip gets the ball and THEY foul HIM
    Worst Case Scenario: Larry's on the line shooting two.

    If it turns into a free throw contest, I still like the Pistons' chances.
    Rip, Stucky and Tay shoot well from the stripe.
    Just because the "Cerebral Touch" is gone doesn't mean we are suddenly incapable of making a clutch foul shot.
  20. CloudWalker

    CloudWalker Bench Warmer

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    I bet Curry didn't tell Dice not to fumble that pass out of bounds, either.

    Time to fire that stupid coach.

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