NFL refs

Discussion in 'Football, Baseball, and Hockey' started by detteam, Sep 25, 2012.

  1. detteam

    detteam All-Star

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    The scabs completely blew a call that affected the outcome of the game tonight.

    I've never been a union fan but the NFL needs to negotiate in order to keep some integrity in the game
  2. detteam

    detteam All-Star

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  3. linwood

    linwood All-Star

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    I watched that game in Seattle, cheering the Seahawks, in a Packers bar. Gotta admit, the Pack got robbed tonight.

    I just looked up the refs salaries. According to the interwebs, the high side of NFL ref pay is $70,000 per season. That's a lot of money for 40 hours or so of work.

    On the other hand, the league wants to expand to 140 refs. If you figure that every ref is earning the high side of $70,000 and you give them all a 20% raise, were talking about less than 2 million dollars per year. That's about one "Tracy MacGrady as a Piston" per year. That has to be worth it to the league.
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  4. LA Dre

    LA Dre All-Star 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    Time to send the replacements back to Footlocker and pay the real officials... tonight was just the icing on the cake for three weeks of bad calls. (i was cheering for the Seahawks too....
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  5. coynejeremy

    coynejeremy All-Star Administrator 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    That was the most awful call I can remember seeing.
  6. coynejeremy

    coynejeremy All-Star Administrator 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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  7. Mogilny

    Mogilny All-Star Forum Donor

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    LMAO! I love it! The new refs are comedy gold. Bring those guys to the superbowl.
  8. Ernie the Slow Adult

    Ernie the Slow Adult All-Star Forum Donor

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    The funny thing is I think these replacement refs are on par with the actual NBA refs who call the games. I did not see the end of last nights game, but watching the Ravens v Patriots on Sunday night I had the same out of control, topsy turvy feeling I had watching the Lakers/Kings G6 or D-Wade's free throw contest during G5 of the finals.

    I would pay $$ to hear what Bill Belichick was saying to those guys.
  9. BillLaimbeer

    BillLaimbeer All-Star 4x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    These replacements make mistakes, but the "real" ones blew calls, too. The Lions got jobbed multiples over the last few years.

    The call last night wasn't that bad. A simultaneous catch goes to the offensive player.

    If it was a bad call, at least the beauty of it was that it caused a Packers loss.
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  10. detteam

    detteam All-Star

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    That was not a simultaneous catch, IMO

    The amazing thing was the refs not only blew the call AND the review...they also missed an obvious pass interference call on Golden Tate.
  11. BillLaimbeer

    BillLaimbeer All-Star 4x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    The review was only to see if it was a catch. The rules do NOT allow the review to reverse which player caught the ball.

    You rarely will see a passer interference call in a hail mary mayhem like that.
  12. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    I don't think that was a call that would have necessarily been correctly made by the real refs.

    Tate seemed to have his left arm around the defender at the time of the catch and it isn't visable after that in any of the replays, so it is unclear whether it remained on the ball the entire time. His right arm initially grabbed the defender's arm and then was repositioned to the ball on the way down.

    It happened really quickly and the refs obviously didn't get a great look at it. They rushed over to the scene and saw both players with a piece of the ball. They decided that the tie goes to the offense and the instant replay was irrelevant after that due to the restrictions that govern what the refs were allowed to reconsider. The pass interference was blatant and occurred just like it always does in hail mary situations.


    Who knows what the refs were thinking? The guy who made the TD call may have only known the "tie goes to the offense" part of the rule and not known the caveat for initial possession. He also may not have known that the determination between offensive and defensive possession was not reviewable.

    On the initial possession concept, I'm not sure that I understand it fully in this case. The defender seemed to have possession of the ball in the air, but that's not real possession at that point, is it? He'd have to touch both feet on the ground and then demonstrate actual control for a brief period of time? So, if the offensive player creates a jump ball type dual control over the ball before that possession is established, is that still a tie?

    Tough situation for any ref, much less a replacement.
  13. coynejeremy

    coynejeremy All-Star Administrator 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    I appreciate the thought that went into that analysis and I think you make totally good points. But the NFL created the rules system that the refs are operating under. And when the rules and technicalities in effect prevent them from ruling what was clearly an interception as an interception, then THE GAME IS RIDICULOUS.

    Also, as right as you may be, the NFL can't paraphrase your quote and put it in a press release. They are in a crapstorm of their own making. Whether the union refs would have made the right call is a matter of debate. What's NOT up for debate is that they couldn't make the right call because the NFL locked them out over an amount of money that was rounding error in the NFL-NFLPA labor fight last year.
  14. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    Upon researching the matter further, here are some additional points to consider:

    1) there is an exception to the rule referring to simultaneous possession. They actually can review it if it occurs in the endzone. So, this play was fully reviewable and the determination was that there wasn't enough visual evidence to overturn the call on the field that gave possession to Seattle. Quote from the NFL:
    2) The replay ref was not a replacement and has been an NFL ref since 1987. So, an actual NFL referee reviewed the play in slow motion multiple times and decided the game in favor of Seattle.

    3) A catch is not a catch until the criteria for a catch have been established. What are the criteria?
    So, there is nothing better about securing a ball with arms or body than with hands. They are equal.

    In this case, I would argue that the catches were simultaneous since they both touched the ground at roughly the same time and since they both maintained control over the ball. If they didn't, then the ball surely would have been ripped away from Tate.


    I think that the definition of a catch is somewhat troublesome to define and leads to issues like this. One complication is that it is meant to benefit the offense by allowing the receivers a little extra time before a dislodged ball is ruled a fumble. That creates a gray area of an undefined length of time where a player can have the ball in his hands before it is officially a catch.


    CONSPIRACY THEORY...
    Slavin upheld the call because he knew that it would make the replacement refs look bad (even though it was technically correct). He was sticking up for his locked out buddies.
  15. Darth Tater

    Darth Tater All-Star Forum Donor 6x Fantasy Champion

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    The replacement refs cannot possibly make the right calls when they don't even fully understand the rules.

    The NFL needs to fix this. Fast. What good can come of this?
  16. Darth Tater

    Darth Tater All-Star Forum Donor 6x Fantasy Champion

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    Last night I was wondering how you felt about this one, Linwood. I was thinking "I will betcha anything (a) Linwood is at a bar right now :) and (B) he is also feeling some cognitive dissonance right now about that win. if the Eagles got that call I would be glad they won and would prefer winning a gAme like that to losing a game like that...but I wouldn't be happy about it either.

    I too rooted against the PAckers but I thought the Packers got screwed on call leading up to that where Woodson was called on pass interference when in fact HE was the one interfered with.
  17. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    What rule was misunderstood by the guys on the field?
  18. Darth Tater

    Darth Tater All-Star Forum Donor 6x Fantasy Champion

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    Nothing that I saw on THAT particular play. I meant overall.

    But they did miss an obvious pAss interference call on that play.

    It also appeared that they didn't communicate properly on the touchdown call.

    Thirdly the one official signaling touchdown messed up the call. Whether it happened quickly or not he messed it up IMO.
  19. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    [​IMG]

    Technically, Tate caught Jennings and maintained control of Jennings even after contact with the ground.
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  20. coynejeremy

    coynejeremy All-Star Administrator 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    But Tate rolled over and let Jennings touch the ground before he got up and handed Jennings to the ref. We all know what that means - incomplete pass.
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