Looks like Dumars will be back..Q....not so much

Discussion in 'Pistons and NBA' started by CloudWalker, Jun 2, 2011.

  1. CloudWalker

    CloudWalker Bench Warmer

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    Gores eager to work with Dumars to rebuild Pistons | NBA.com


  2. BillLaimbeer

    BillLaimbeer All-Star 4x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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  3. G-man

    G-man Starter

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    the secret.. get ready.. here it is..

    "We need to go back to those core values," Gores said. "It's hard work, you go to practice, and the winning will come."

    uh oh..


    :stirthepot:
  4. MJO77

    MJO77 First Round Draft Pick

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    practice?
  5. pass99

    pass99 All-Star Forum Donor

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    Here is what I picked up on two important and perhaps settle points.

    First, the following quote:
    "We're going to lean on him pretty heavy. He knows basketball, and we're going to push Joe. He knows that," Gores said. "Our job is to challenge Joe."

    The framework of this comes from multiple directions: In the beginning you have had your talent and a deep perspective from personal experience. You made decisions from multiple influences or at least dominate opinions that made the directions your own. Combinations of maintenance, boundary closure, boundary seepage, time, events and details are story placements. This leads to The Goldberg Rule, "Don't ask 'What's the problem,' ask 'What's the story?' That way you'll find out what the problem really is." This comes out of the old journalistic questions: Who, What, When, Where, Why and How. In a sense, Gores is telling those that might pick up on this, that we will help (not challenge) JD in scenario planning. In other words, we will help set up a reasonably plausible, but structurally different futures. This will be a much different way of thinking for JD.

    Second, notice Gores description of organizational stability or strength. All of the appendages of the organization (Owner, Administration, Mid-levels such as Coaching, Players, PR and Language Control) must have cohesive integration. Most organizations are not integrated and all our eyes have glazed over these last few years as the Piston organization has imploded. History, from the Detroit view, has been dragging Fordism around until...until...until...now...and deer hunting is no longer a sport. And if your're going to do it with Jesus, then go here: Joe Bageant. JD need not feel lonely.

    Also, notice another word that Gores used. He brought out the word, or a descriptive process called, matrix's. Again, this is a structurally placement of organizations that create self-imposed learning loops. These loops had major components: perception, institutionalization, and action. This was good stuff 20 years ago and most organizations still stick with a large white board that has an outstanding eraser.

    The current matrix's have grown appendages. The model structures have deepened and are called by the acronym: VUCA. This stands for volatility, uncertainty, complexity and ambiguity.

    Are we having fun yet?
  6. dba

    dba All-Star Moderator 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    How about Joe D out, Donnie Walsh in?
  7. Mogilny

    Mogilny All-Star Forum Donor

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    Isn't Donnie 89 years old? I'd rather go with someone who can be a long term solution. I wouldn't mind to start over with a new GM together with the new owner. Not because of Joes track record lately but more because Joe is pretty biased when it comes to explaining to Gores why we are where we are. "Oh yeah, this Rip contract might actually not be so bad", "I actually think Gordon might turn out pretty good", "Charlie sure can hit line drives from behind the arc", "oh my, we had a lot of injuries" etc. It's an exaggeration but I can see some less than objective explainations when Joe explains why things turned out the way they did. It's not like he's irreplacable so I'm all for a new guy just for the sake of bringing in an unbiased guy to sort this mess out.
  8. max

    max All-Star

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    I took the "push him real hard and challenge him" part as Gores saying we will keep you but you have to step up your game. Excuses aside. Maybe he could not make any moves the past 2 years but the team was definitely headed south already with bloated contracts and poor hiring decisions. Dumars is going to get another chance so we will see what he does with it. Maybe he needs someone pushing him.
  9. Nemo

    Nemo Pun Master Forum Donor

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    Agreed here...:)
  10. dba

    dba All-Star Moderator 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    Not in the picture they always show. Maybe it's a reverse Dorian Gray thing.
  11. Mogilny

    Mogilny All-Star Forum Donor

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    Joe is safe for three years according to Chad Ford.

    Joe Dumars has three years to get the Detroit Pistons on track « PistonPowered

    :cold:

  12. BallDon'tLie

    BallDon'tLie All-Star 3x Fantasy Champion

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    ...Fad Chord.
  13. Brap

    Brap Starter

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    That's good news, assuming Ford is correct - which he tends to be about the direction the Pistons are taking. Joe can wait it out now as he gathers the right players.

    He doesn't have to trade Rip, getting dead-weight in salary back in return. Instead, he can let his contract get into expiring status next season and then trade him or just let him expire to clear salary space.

    He can make draft picks that are going to impact the team in 2 more seasons, but who won't do much this season. So, he can pick the Euro guy who has a funny contract and leave him in Europe for a season.

    He can tank the team, to get a super pick in next year's draft.

    Besides - with the Super Team in Miami, building a team that can start to compete at high levels in 3 years, as Wade starts to fade, and LeBron gets some miles on him, might be better timing for us. It's hard to imagine how any team is going to compete with that group of cowardly colluders.
  14. Nemo

    Nemo Pun Master Forum Donor

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  15. Walter

    Walter All-Star Forum Donor

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    Incidentally, three years is when the contracts of Rip, CV, Gordon, Maxiell and Bynum are all going to be up. It seems to me that Gores' direction to Joe D is to not make bad trades just to unload those guys, but improve the team through attrition. Replace mistake signings with good signings as the contracts expire.

    So, probably next year will be another sad season, but things will start to improve very slowly after that.
  16. pass99

    pass99 All-Star Forum Donor

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    So you think that Gores will be setting on the edge of his Piston seat, just flaying his arms about, while commenting, "it's all about attrition"?
  17. Walter

    Walter All-Star Forum Donor

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    Yes, but instead of flaying his arms, he'll tilt his head.

    In all seriousness, and despite his promises about swift action, I expect a series of slow, but calculated moves. I suspect we'll suck again next year and will win about 42 games in 2012-13 season.
  18. Nemo

    Nemo Pun Master Forum Donor

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    I'd consider that a veeeerrry promising outlook. .500 bball in 2 years..:)
  19. Nemo

    Nemo Pun Master Forum Donor

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  20. LA Dre

    LA Dre All-Star 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    Guess somebody other than Joe had to be in Gores ear.....he has to hear it from somebody outside the Pistons org, otherwise all he would hear was Joe's side of the story.....on why Laimbeer is not the man for the HC job...

    Lets hope that Checketts provides that outside view of the Pistons needs.....maybe/hopefully he is a Piston forum member.....

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