Indiana December 29th, 8:00PM

Discussion in 'December 2006' started by Dlev59, Dec 27, 2006.

  1. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2005
    Messages:
    20,549
    Likes Received:
    2,409
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Dagobah
    Jay, you want Delf on the court, so then don't pull this "Flip murray" jazz when Carlos makes a mistake.

    You're right. He screwed up. The other night, everyone was falling over themselves to give him kudos. When you play, you're the hero or the goat. Not everyone can be like Tayshaun, start and float 8 games out of 10.
     
  2. himat

    himat Bench Warmer

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2005
    Messages:
    3,759
    Likes Received:
    2
    Chauncey-had a career high 12 rebounds. The Pistons outrebounded the Pacers well, but were beat by stupid turnovers, and slow rotations. It can easily be fixed, but it still has to be fixed. Flip should of made these guys work their butts of in practice after Wednesday, but I bet he didn't.

    I'd fall for that pumpfake. In that situation Delfino thought there was very little time left and that Armstrong had to put up a shot. It was a great veteran move. Speaking about good veteran moves why in the world would Flip make the guys run a halfcourt press. Does he seriously think he'd get a TO and a shot for his team running that? The Pistons should of ran back and gaurded the hoop and allow a half courter in the first place.

    Chauncey is going to be out 10-14 days according to WDFN. Even if he's only out 10 days he'll miss games against the Suns, Hornets, and Bulls. I hope Chauncey stays out for 14 days or possibly more than because the week after the Bulls game is a cakewalk if the Pistons do what they are supposed to do.

    Don't let the score fool you. Pistons should of lost that game, and were clearly outplayed. It's simple stuff that have been so frustrating so far this season. Slow rotations, turnovers, boxouts. It's time to get it fixed, and have a meaningful win.
     
  3. Dumars4Ever

    Dumars4Ever Bench Warmer

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2006
    Messages:
    2,175
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Washington DC area
    The main problem tonight was turnovers. They've only averaged 11 per game this season, but they had 19 tonight. If they had taken care of the ball like they usually do, they would have had a pretty solid win.
     
  4. himat

    himat Bench Warmer

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2005
    Messages:
    3,759
    Likes Received:
    2
    Stupid mistakes. A key one was a Granger steal on Rip.

    As for the Chauncey injury. It's so easy to see that he's getting worn out. Is Flip the only one blind to this?? Stop playing him more than 40 minutes every game. A player would not get injured the way he did if he was well rested. His legs gave out on him. Keep him on the sidelines for a while Joe. Playoffs are what matter.
     
  5. lapeapod

    lapeapod First Round Draft Pick

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2006
    Messages:
    221
    Likes Received:
    0
    I'm so glad I can come here and have spirited discussions about the Pistons. I live and die with these guys and one good thing about tonight's game (serious no monkey here) at least we're not talking about that 3OT game in New York anymore. In the misery loves company department I got great joy in seeing that Kobe was both the hero and the goat in his game tonight. He scored 58 points but pulled a couple of bone-headed plays including fouling a player shooting a 3 point shot. See it's not just bench players that make errors, even Hall of Fame players make mistakes. If basketball was mistake free what fun would that be? You have to feel the pains of heartbreak sometimes to really savor the victories. I hate seeing the Pistons lose two games in a row that they could have easily won but that's what builds character.
     
  6. himat

    himat Bench Warmer

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2005
    Messages:
    3,759
    Likes Received:
    2
    I agree with you their. I'm not ticked about the loss. The only way I will be is if nothing is gained out of the loss. What I am ticked about is Flip substitution pattern. He had it for a while thier things were going great. He keeps riding Chauncey. Chauncey said that he felt something pop, he probably right.
     
  7. mercury

    mercury Bench Warmer

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2005
    Messages:
    3,396
    Likes Received:
    10
    Location:
    Amish Hood
    Delfino becomes an axe murderer... and there's BBall saying it was Ben playing Jedi mind tricks on him.
    it's ok BBall, Delfino and Darko are not perfect.... and Ben's a good player.... seek the truth and you will be free.
     
  8. lapiston

    lapiston Team Captain

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2005
    Messages:
    1,213
    Likes Received:
    196
    This is a bad patch for the team.

    Delfino made a very bad play. Rip hit two key free throws but he also got stripped going one on one late. But these are small matters.

    Here is what really bothers me:

    1) We just got out played again by Indiana. We truly miss Ben against this team and we have to prove that we can beat them without Ben. Of course, Sheed was basically out which helped them. They controlled the game at key points just as we usually control the game. We were problably tired from the Knick game. Still, they took the game at the crucial times like a team is suppose to and held on.

    2) How shortsided was it to play our key guys so many minutes in that meaningless Knick game and not have them ready for the Pacers and now the Suns.

    3) The Chauncey injury sure looks like it might be based on too many minutes in a short span...

    4) Was that a little bit of playoff fold in the 2nd and 3rd quarters and the inability of the coach to reverse his team? This felt too much like last year. We did come back though.

    5) We are just not intense like the Spurs and Suns to name two top teams. We get the lead and float and then we start to press, go one on one and it just gets worse. Sometimes we don't play with the proper amount of fear...


    Positives:

    Davis defense, Maxiell's play and jumper. Our best team late against many teams may be Prince, Sheed and Maxiell on the front line. Maxiell's development may be the key to the season.
     
  9. LA Dre

    LA Dre All-Star 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2005
    Messages:
    12,779
    Likes Received:
    1,768
    Location:
    Rancho Cucamonga, CA
    This game was lost in the second qtr when Flip brought all of the starters back in. Rip was forcing shots and Sheed was a step slow with the flu and probably should have never came back in after the first quarter. O'Neal tookoff the previous game with the flu just so he'd beready to terrorize the Pistons and of course he did!!! (Don't NBA teams give mandatory flu shots to all of their players?)

    Too many TO's and for the 3rd game in a row, we struggle offensively vs a team that although good we should have beaten. When the lead got up to 15 in the second qtr, I like many thougth the game was over. In fact I told my wife who sat through the game with me that if the lead gets to 20 the Pistons would win and we could flip to another game. Of course as is Flips forte, he saves his time outs and lets the Pacers pull off a 13-2 run before he decides to call a TO.

    The Pistons start off slow in the third as once again Rip tries to get off and Tay again relies on jumpers or scoop shots instead of taking it directly to the hoop.

    Nice game by the bench, but recall a stat midway through the second qtr (before Flp pulled them) indicating that they had 25 of the 43 points. Unfortunately they only scored 2 the rest of the game....

    Can't fault Delfino for the late foul as it could happen to anyone. We should have never been in the situation in the first place. Armstrong scores 1 point, the winning pt, so he is the playa of the game.

    The bad CB down for the next 5 or so games and both Ben and Labron cheering that injury since they both win and are now only one game back. The good, CB gets the rest and we get to see how the Blaylock and Murray fair in possible starting roles.
     
  10. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2005
    Messages:
    20,549
    Likes Received:
    2,409
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Dagobah
    AI plays 40+ all the time and drives into the lane and gets hammered.

    Maybe CB should have spent the summer with a personal trainer. It's flat out embarassing when Flip Saunders says the best player in training camp was Dale Davis.

    Shameful for the brahma, Delfino, Billups, Tay even Hamilton.
     
  11. himat

    himat Bench Warmer

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2005
    Messages:
    3,759
    Likes Received:
    2
    Roscoe, AI is unreal. Not everyone is like him. He's one of the toughest players this league has ever seen.
     
  12. Dumars4Ever

    Dumars4Ever Bench Warmer

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2006
    Messages:
    2,175
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Washington DC area
    I don't think that's right. My notes say that the bench had 19 in the first half. They had 27 for the game, so they did score most of their pts in the first half, and it looks like Delfino didn't score at all in the second half. But JMax definitely hit a few shots in the second half.
     
  13. KGREG

    KGREG All-Star

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2005
    Messages:
    4,860
    Likes Received:
    803
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Saginaw, Michigan
    In the press conference they noted that from the midway point of the 2nd qtr to the midway point of the 3rd we got roasted......that's the starters time, the bench was phenomenal, the 4+1 system really does work well for us. 2 things went wrong tonight
    1-Sheed should never have returned in the 2nd qtr, even before they said he was sick it was obvious that we was a step slow tonight, the last few weeks for that matter, and he just absolutely killed us.

    2-Mr.Big SHot/Big Head; again tried to do too much. Blalock "runs the offense", BS thinks HE is the offense. His Defense has been AWFUL as of late and his decision making is lost. It kills me how he won't look in the direction of Delfino and Maxiel when he's on the court with them.

    There's no way I see Joe not breaking this group up, they're not good enough to win a championship.
     
  14. LA Dre

    LA Dre All-Star 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2005
    Messages:
    12,779
    Likes Received:
    1,768
    Location:
    Rancho Cucamonga, CA
    you may be right there. I just recall seeing that 25 pt stat, and thought it was posted in the first half. I get upset when they lose give out the wrong info.

    The good thing is that the Lakers lost in a triple OT with Kobe scoring 58, after the local radio guys were cheering that they would come home with a 4-2 east coast swing. 3-3 is what it is without Odom.
     
  15. Warthog

    Warthog Bench Warmer

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2005
    Messages:
    2,587
    Likes Received:
    6
    Location:
    Sterling Heights, MI
    i don't think anyone should be riding carlos. he had a fantastic game. his foul was with 0.9 SECONDS LEFT. would YOU be thinking the guy is gonna pump fake, when he's got almost no time left to shoot? i would've went up to block the shot too and taken my chances that my opponent wouldn't risk not getting a shot off in time.

    carlos had a great game, tayshaun looked good early when he was driving the basket, maxiell was our best offensive weapon by far, flip shoulda played blalock at the start of the 4th rather than mid-way through to give chauncey the proper rest, and at least rip is driving to the basket trying to make plays, instead of settling for long jumpers.

    as i've said before, these kind of losses need to happen. the pistons need to keep realizing they must improve. our bench has been getting more and more experience, which everyone said they'd gladly sacrifice a few wins for. and for everyone saying trade CB, if he's out for 10-14 days you're about to find out how valuable he truly is (even though i thought he sucked AGAIN tonight, despite the 12 boards).

    we lost when it was 43-29 and we stopped being aggressive because indiana couldn't hit a shot to save their life and we felt safe not scoring. i'd have kept the bench in the rest of the 2nd quarter.
     
  16. himat

    himat Bench Warmer

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2005
    Messages:
    3,759
    Likes Received:
    2
    Chauncey looks like the best PG or one of the best when he's got energy. On the flip side he looks like one of the worst when he's tired. No joke he looks like he's not even a top 20 PG when he is tired.

    I think 4-5 minutes off his playing time will do the trick. I would love for it to be more, but that would be just fine. 4-5 minutes doesn't seem to be a big deal, but the reason guys get worn out is when they play these minutes for a long time constantly. There are only a few people who don't let it effect them.
     
  17. lapiston

    lapiston Team Captain

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2005
    Messages:
    1,213
    Likes Received:
    196
    We were playing really poorly against both NY and NJ. Worse, our guys played too many minutes only to LOSE against NY. Losing during the regular season is one thing, but then to lose AND not be ready for the better teams is not what a veteran team does.

    Now, the Pacers can have some real confidence against us which bothers me. I agree with DRE that the game was lost in the 2nd and 3rd quarters where they took it to us. They controlled the game--that is what we are supposed to do.

    We sure do not look ready for the Suns, another key game.


    Ok. What is encouraging is that we can get some real D from Davis--he can play bigger minutes in the playoffs. And Maxiell has a jumper. League, watch out!!
     
  18. LA Dre

    LA Dre All-Star 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2005
    Messages:
    12,779
    Likes Received:
    1,768
    Location:
    Rancho Cucamonga, CA
    I have seen other coaches leave their bench in for an entire quarter or even 8+ minutes either to rest their starters or to punish them, but Flip always brings his back in even when the bench is superb.

    For the life me I just cannot fathom why he continues in everygame letting the opposition put together a double digit run before he calls a TO. It happen in NY and three times tonight when they jumped off to a 12-2 run and then closed out the second qtr on 19-4 run and started the 3rd qtr with a 12-3 run. I notice both Zeke and RC called TO's anytime the Pistons ran off a 6-0 run at minimum.
     
  19. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2005
    Messages:
    17,630
    Likes Received:
    2,964
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Chicaaago
    Isn't this what we have Flip Murray for? Insurance.

    Again, I'm flabbergasted that Chauncey takes criticism for his play in this game. He led the team in points, rebounds, assists, and steals. Then he hit a big 3-pointer at the end to give us a shot (and he did it off of 1 leg). This is not a good opportunity for anyone. This is just a chance for us to lose games. Blalock has been getting an amazing amount of PT already for a guy who takes ZERO shots per game. Acker would be nice to have right now, but he's kicking butt in Europe at the moment.

    Here is my real question though:
    How can Jermaine O'Neal get 25 points and 10 free throw attempts, when Nazr and Davis only had 1 foul a piece. Did Dyess do all of the fouling? If so, then he shouldn't have been guarding him.

    JMax and Delfino were the positives. Delfino made a mistake by fouling at the end, but otherwise played well. He'll learn from the experience.
     
  20. lapiston

    lapiston Team Captain

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2005
    Messages:
    1,213
    Likes Received:
    196
    TaShawn,

    Oneal's play is what bothers me against the Pacers. We use to contain him well with Ben. This is one team not having Ben seems to matter. you are right--we only played so-so. We did not put the hammer down when we had the chance. Of course, Sheed wasn't really there to help.

    Agree on Blalock. He hasn't shown much offense and that is a problem.

    Maxiell is a big bright spot. I don't see the better teams having the personnel to contain him.
     

Share This Page