If you could change one decision joe dumars made...

Discussion in 'Pistons and NBA' started by blueadams, May 6, 2009.

  1. blueadams

    blueadams Team Captain

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    #1) Drafting Darko over Melo. Don't talk to me about Bosh or Wade, because this was a two-horse race at the time. Larry Brown wanted Melo, and Dumars should've given him what he wanted. A championship team with the #2 overall pick!? and in that draft!? As nba fans, we will probably never see another situation like this. He would've had the same contract as Darko, so we still could have traded for, and resigned Rasheed. Might have won 3 or 4 championships with this move...and we'd have a super-star to build our next generation around (though we'd probably still be playing at a championship caliber with these guys).

    C: Ben Wallace
    PF: Rasheed Wallace
    SF: Carmello Anthony
    SG: Richard Hamilton
    PG: Chauncey Billups
    6th: Tayshaun Prince

    #2) Drafting Rodney White over Joe Johnson. Though mistake #1 gets most the attention, this move was almost as tragic. I guess it's sort of hard to hold this one against Dumars, because it was rumored that Rodney was going to be a top 3 or 4 pick before slipping on draft night. Still though, he overlooked the uber-athletic six foot nine point guard from arkansas. This team wouldn't have been much worse than the +Melo squad.

    C: Ben Wallace
    PF: Rasheed Wallace
    SF: Joe Johnson
    SG: Richard Hamilton
    PG: Chauncey Billups
    6th: Tayshaun Prince

    #3) Firing Larry Brown. Look, next to maybe greg poppovich, this guy is the best basketball coach on the planet. You don't fire a guy like this for expressing interest in another job. You fight your arse off to keep him. If we had him instead of Flip over the last few seasons, I'm willing to bet that we would have won at least one more championship.

    #4) Drafting Carlos Delfino over Josh Howard. Joe Dumars Euro-spree in the 2001 draft really, really killed us. Right after drafting darko, we selected Carlos Delfino (who didn't even join us for what, two seasons!? and in the middle of a championship run) with the next wing on the board being Josh Howard. As a starting SF or as an exciting swing-man, he could have made a big difference.

    C: Ben Wallace
    PF: Rasheed Wallace
    SF: Josh Howard
    SG: Richard Hamilton
    PG: Chauncey Billups
    6th: Tayshaun Prince

    #5) Drafting Mateen Cleaves over Hidayet Turkoglu. It's hard to rip Dumars here, because we still weren't sure about Grant Hill, and we needed a point guard badly, but still, talent is talent. Either as a starting SF or as sweet scoring 6th man, he would have made a big difference here.

    C: Ben Wallace
    PF: Rasheed Wallace
    SF: Hidayet Turkoglu
    SG: Richard Hamilton
    PG: Chauncey Billups
    6th: Tayshaun Prince
  2. Darth Tater

    Darth Tater All-Star Forum Donor 6x Fantasy Champion

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    In order:

    #1 Drafting Darko over Melo.
    #1 Drafting Darko over Melo.
    #1 Drafting Darko over Melo.
    #1 Drafting Darko over Melo.
    #1 Drafting Darko over Melo.
    #1 Drafting Darko over Melo.
    #1 Drafting Darko over Melo.

    after those, I guess I would say:

    #1 Drafting Darko over Melo.
  3. Pistons Lover

    Pistons Lover First Round Draft Pick

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    Bomb squads. Them together could've easily won 4 championships over those six years going to the ECFs.

    Can't be put any better!!!
  4. Latinoking90

    Latinoking90 Bench Warmer

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    Not grabbing Melo. I got to cry myself to sleep tonight, for being reminded again. Thanks!

    Maybe Joe should be the GM for the Nuggets!

    Melo + Chauncey >(∞)> Darko + AI
  5. lpgrl26

    lpgrl26 Bench Warmer

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    If i had to pick one, #3
  6. Tha Locstah

    Tha Locstah First Round Draft Pick 1x Fantasy Champion

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    I think drafting Darko over most of the people available with a lottery pick that year was the #1 mistake. I remember the night we found out what pick we were getting and I said, "hello, Melo!" but my cousin said "no, I heard Joe wants this Darko kid". The rest is history.
  7. Tha Locstah

    Tha Locstah First Round Draft Pick 1x Fantasy Champion

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    Oh yeah, I forgot to mention how weak the argument was at the time.......what sense does it make to draft Melo? We have Tayshaun!
  8. detteam

    detteam All-Star

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    #3 may have been the result of #1.
  9. Smoooth

    Smoooth First Round Draft Pick

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    Number 1, really costed us.
  10. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    Tay was a starter on a Championship team. The logic was correct. Big men are hard to come by and it was worth the gamble. In hindsight, Bosh would have been a better choice (while still gambling on a big).
  11. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    IIRC, Melo was not brought in for a workout. Bosh was.
  12. lapiston

    lapiston Team Captain

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    Darko.





    Ok, GM's usually go for the big and it was the era of Shaq.


    But you don't use a number two on an unknown guy.



    Darko.

    We are feeling the effects today of that pick.
  13. 16 Mile

    16 Mile Bench Warmer

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    Melo would never have played meaningful minutes, Tay was a lock at 35+ per game, and no way Joe would have traded Tay. At that time we had locks at every position but the pf, Joe was looking for backups and future starters, meaning Wade and Carmello would have bolted the first chance, Bosh might have worked.

    The other mistakes you list, I don't really think were that bad. Delfino over Howard? Howard is a better player, but with his attitude he would have been long gone.

    Joe's biggest mistakes:
    1. Drafting JMax over David Lee
    2. With the quote "starting five" being so secure, there was no chance of competition by anyone on the bench to ever gain meaningful minutes. The bench players we have now are just happy to get any pt they can get, not one of them is showing any hunger to try and bust into the starting lineup (with the exception of Bynum, who wasn't here during the previous era)
    3. Allowing the inmates to run the asylum. Whatever you think about Flip, the team would not have been able to disrepect him like they did if Joe didn't allow it. Small wonder we have the attitudes we have now on this team.
  14. LA Dre

    LA Dre All-Star 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    Yeah but we weren't champions yet...We had just been swept by the Nets a few weeks before the Darko Draft Debacle and Tay had only started 5 games that year prior to the playoffs. His stats for that year showed that he averaged 3.3 ppg and 1.1 rpg as Micheal Curry's backup. His production increased in the playoffs to 9.4 ppg, but just like Joe had faith in Stuckey this past summer, he put all that faith in Tay and passed on Melo, which I believe could have won us at least two more rings if he had been drafted. He and Tay could have shared that SF position until LB decided who should start and who should be the back up.

    2002-03 Detroit Pistons Roster and Statistics - Basketball-Reference.com

    That IMO is/was Joe's biggest blunder and the Pistons have paid for it the past 5 years.
  15. Ernie the Slow Adult

    Ernie the Slow Adult All-Star Forum Donor

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    It is either not taking Melo or letting LB go and I'll go with not keeping LB. He could get something meaningful out of Tay so that gives him the edge.
  16. Ernie the Slow Adult

    Ernie the Slow Adult All-Star Forum Donor

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    Melo may have gotten beaten up by LB for a bit, but unless he just folded and went into a shell his talent would win out.
  17. max

    max All-Star

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    Consider the 2 deals that fell through. Re-signing Hill for the max and bringing Webber in for the max. That would have eaten up most of the cap space and there would have been no playoff run at all.

    I don't think there was much that could have been done to keep LB. Did they handle it right? No but that does not change the fact that the Knicks were standing by to triple his salary. Could we have matched? LB would have had to leave 12 mil on the table then from the buyout.
  18. mikhail1973

    mikhail1973 All-Star Administrator 1x Fantasy Champion

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    It is painful to pick any of them. Even the Joe Johnson miss was huge. But nobody can predict the future, so you live with whatever you get.
  19. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    I'm obviously not arguing that Tay already had a championship at that point. But Joe made the determination that Tay was a good enough fit at the SF position to pass on Melo and take a gamble on a big. And in that respect, Joe was dead on... because we won a ship with Tay at the 3, where he played a key role.

    And don't forget how much LB loved to sit Melo when he coached him on the Olympic team.
    And don't forget the immaturity that Carmelo displayed over the past 5 years, with the DUI arrest being the most recent.

    Does Billups have anything to do with Anthony finally getting it?


    If you really think about it, there is a possibility that we would not have a championship if we would have drafted Melo. We could also have 3 in a row. If you've seen Back to the Future I, II, and III, then you know how senstive events can be to even the most minor changes.
  20. LA Dre

    LA Dre All-Star 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    Yeah that is why the GM has to decide every year..do you draft for need or the best player available?

    Some times it also depends on what position or draft order you are picking too, as the first 5-6 lottery picks are normally all good and you can usually select based on need and the later first round picks you try to pick the best athlete or talent left on the board.

    The problem is who vetted Darko's status and sold Joe on selecting him?? Should LB have thrown him in there right away as Ben's backup??...which could have brought out the talents that he supposedly had??? After all of the other players drafted in the top 5 that year all started (I believe) for their teams that season and got plenty of PT.

    So in hindsight, would LB have kept Melo at the end of the bench like he did Dorko, or would Melo's talent won out enough where he could not afford to have kept him sidelined? Also the other question that we will never know is would the Pistons team environment at the time kept Melo in check and assisted him in maturing faster than it did with him out there in the Mile High rockies>>:confused:

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