How much Money for Moo$e

Discussion in 'Pistons and NBA' started by KGREG, Nov 2, 2013.

  1. KGREG

    KGREG All-Star

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    Interesting article here Gordon Hayward, Utah Jazz in talks on contract extension - ESPN
    I'm thinking Moose gets more than Favors and less than Cousins. I'm thinking 5 years $67.5M ($13.5M/yr), especially since Smith is making about $13.5M/yr. The problem is that the stupid Lakers may offer him a max deal that we are forced to match.
  2. Ernie the Slow Adult

    Ernie the Slow Adult All-Star Forum Donor

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    I guess he's worth about that based on everyone else, but I am not a big fan of his game.

    He is a one way player who mopes and jogs around the court a lot. I don't think he is that good at his one thing either. He grossly pads his rebound numbers because he misses so many 2' shots.

    I've never watched him and thought he was dominant. Let he, Franchise and CCG go and sign Melo!


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  3. basketbills

    basketbills All-Star Forum Donor

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    Last edited: Nov 2, 2013
  4. vincy4fish98

    vincy4fish98 Bench Warmer

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    Don't get me wrong. I like Monroe, I think he is becoming a good perhaps borderline great player. Is he a franchise player, leader, one that you build your team around? He has the physical skills and fundamentals, but he strikes me as being a player that lacks that fire. I know we often mention him and hope he becomes a Duncan, although Duncan has an expressionless even keeled attitude, if you look closely at his eyes you that fire burning below. I don't see that with Monroe. I see a sense of entitlement, lackadaisical entitlement. I don't see a leader that grabs his teammates and lets them know what they should do and pulls them aside. I see this with Drummond. I may get flamed, but I prefer players to wear their heart on their sleeves and play like their hair is on fire and if this was the last game on earth they would leave it all on the floor. Every great player has had it, that burning fire in their eyes like they care to cut it out of their opponent-Zeke, Magic, Bird, Jordan, Kobe, Duncan, and I hate to say it but Lebron is starting to get there.

    Monroe I just don;t see it. Not worth the max and if someone is willing to go out and snag him for an exorbitant amount, let them have him. There is value in return and there is stupidity. I have had my fill of BG and CG to last a lifetime.
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  5. KGREG

    KGREG All-Star

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    It's no longer about what we think a guy is worth, the market determines their worth and the market says Joe must pay Greg Monroe more money than what he wanted to pay Ben Wallace. $11M/yr for Larry Sanders????
  6. Mogilny

    Mogilny All-Star Forum Donor

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    He is a jump shot from being David Lee, not a jump shot from being Tim Duncan. Certainly not a max player. Somewhere around $12M sounds fair but there will always be some team that goes crazy and offer him more. I just hope it isn't Detroit.
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  7. vincy4fish98

    vincy4fish98 Bench Warmer

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    The market may very well determine what he is worth. The question is do we play along like a lemming and follow the market, or as a shrewd investor determine his intrinsic worth right now based on past performance and extrapolating out what he is about to do in the future. If the market bids it up beyond what our intrinsic figure says, the smart thing to do is say pass. Let it blow up in someone else's face. We all hope but I think Gores and company are pretty good at determining return on investment.
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  8. KGREG

    KGREG All-Star

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    And have you seen how much David Lee is getting paid?
    HoopsHype - NBA Salaries - Golden State Warriors

    What if this team wins 50 games and Moose averages 18 and 10? Do you let that just walk away? It's not about just paying Moose it's about keeping a core group together to improve.
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  9. linwood

    linwood All-Star

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    Greg Monroe is the Pistons best player right now. If you don't want to pay him, who do you realistically acquire to replace him?

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  10. Mogilny

    Mogilny All-Star Forum Donor

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    Yes, and I consider him to be both overpaid and a better player.
    What if he becomes the best player in the league? What if he breaks his back and ends up in a wheel chair? I re-evaluate if the conditions change
    I don't agree, he's no doubt behind Smith and I'm not sure if he's better than Drummond. Some other free agent I guess. He's a good player but I'm not breaking the bank for a non-all-star one-way player.
    .
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  11. KGREG

    KGREG All-Star

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    Fair enough. But remember, if the team has a successful year I think it becomes less about paying Moose and more about paying to keep the success intact.
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  12. vincy4fish98

    vincy4fish98 Bench Warmer

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    I guess Moose has another 80 games to audition why he is worthy of a max contract. I know players look at other players to see what they are getting. I get that, they want the most money possible, owners and organizations want to save money or at least get value in return. That's why they negotiate, you go high, I go low and somewhere in between we meet or compromise. I realize he may be an important component or cog in the wheel. I just don't think he is in the pantheon of players when all is said and done of the greats. When was the last time you were excited to go to a game because Greg Monroe is in the house? Did he fill seats?

    I also don't care that he is the best player on the team. What I care about is that is he "the" player? If he is so good why hasn't he carried us to a playoff yet? I know he was po'd that the Olympic team didn;t even consider him for tryouts the last go around. Then do something about it in the regular season, don't talk about it in the press. The league is littered with guys as good or better than him statistically who never won a championship. I know I am just a lowly fan with a cheap opinion, but if I were to financially manage the team and open up my purse strings, Greg Monroe better be Coca Cola or McDonalds stock because I want a sure thing that rings (pun intended) that cash register.
  13. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    Joe has always been pretty good about keeping future salary space open. We've never really run a full time luxury tax operation.

    Monroe puts up good numbers, but do they translate into wins, or is he another Kings era Mitch Richmond?

    Drummond is playing out of his mind right now and he's still relatively a baby. You have to wonder if letting Moose go opens up flexibility for us (particularly if we can do a S&T) to play Smith and Drummond at the 4+5, and look for shooting at the 3. Because I think we all know that Smith can play the 3, but he's really an elite 4.
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  14. Ernie the Slow Adult

    Ernie the Slow Adult All-Star Forum Donor

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    A few things here:

    I think the "max" is way less than what it used to be. We're not talking 18-20 million per annum.

    Throw a rock towards last years Andre Drummond games and you'll find him impacting more games than Monroe ever has.

    V Goodwill of the DetNews has mentioned that he's never seen Monroe so active on both ends of the floor. I haven't really noticed that, but it's bad if it is true because it's contract time.

    If he's a big part of them playing well then I have no problem paying him, but I think the sign and trade is the way to go.

    His quote of, 'I (one of the worst defenders alive) don't have a problem communicating, but my teammates do.', speaks volumes.


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  15. Nemo

    Nemo Pun Master Forum Donor

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    His personna is closer to Stuckey than to Drummond. Sign and trade.
  16. linwood

    linwood All-Star

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    Two games into our New and Exciting front court, and there's talk about getting rid of one of the big 3.

    I don't think Monroe is perfect, but I think he is pretty good. He passes well, scores and rebounds. At least for the first two games, he seems to have pretty good chemistry with Drummond and Smith. He's young.

    Most importantly, who would we get that would be an improvement? I think Cousins would be an improvement, but he's getting the Max and he's not going anywhere.
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  17. webz

    webz All-Star Snub Administrator 2x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    I'm just gonna watch and wait to see how this season pans out. There's no need to make a decision now, and that's exactly how both sides are taking this. The ball is in Monroe's court. If he continues to produce and the team gets wins the rest will figure itself out. I am wary of giving him the max but Moose really is the only consistent low-post threat we have right now. Drummond is not close to having an effective post game and Smith just doesn't go down there often enough. At least Monroe is the one guy who is consistently on the block and able to draw double teams and/or score 1 on 1. Without him we would likely regress into being a jumpshooting team. And that I am scared of more than anything.
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  18. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    That's a good point webz. We're a points in the paint team now. It is amazing!
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  19. Ernie the Slow Adult

    Ernie the Slow Adult All-Star Forum Donor

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    Who is double teaming Monroe? I don't feel like teams do much to try and stop him save for trying to strip him when he spins.


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  20. Walter

    Walter All-Star Forum Donor

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    I am stunned by the generally negative attitude towards Monroe. He is the second best player on this team (behind Smith) and is our #1 scorer. He is a very very good scoring center in this league who also happens to rebound very well and has quick hands that result in steals, he's a decent passer. To boot, he is still improving. Most notably, he seems to be hitting those fritos better this year. The dude is legit talent. Why don't we just enjoy what we are seeing guys?
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