Flip

Discussion in 'Pistons and NBA' started by Slippy, Oct 3, 2006.

  1. mercury

    mercury Bench Warmer

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    I'm not sure that we can go under the assumption that Flip won't change some of his own weaknesses. Like working more on the inside game or focusing more on defense... maybe something like "hey guys how but more effort on your man defense" lol
  2. Lee356

    Lee356 All-Star

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    Got to agree 100%. The guy will never, in my opinion, ever get better as a coach without admitting past mistakes. From the above, and from everything else I have heard him say, the idea that anything could possibly be his fault totally escapes him. So he is doomed to stay exactly like he is. Everyone needs to improve. Even if he is a decent coach (debateable) he will never become a great coach if he keeps thinking everything going on around him thats negative has nothing to do with his actions (or inactions)
  3. hack

    hack First Round Draft Pick

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    Sorry you don't like my post, prof. Just MO. Wish I would be like Roscoe and mellow out, before I get into the heartattack zone, but that doesn't seem to be happening.

    Roscoe's point is valid -- you take a title any way you can get one. There's nothing inherently better about winning 88-80 than there is about winning 120-112. Problem is there's pretty much no precedent for this, and ,therefore, no reason to believe it's gonna happen soon much less become an established pattern that rivals the ``O wins games/D wins rings'' maxim.
  4. max

    max All-Star

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    I think its going to be a lot different this year. Last year he was given a lot of slack on the assumption that he was going to bring home the trophy.

    This year there are 2 qualified assistants ready to take over at any time.
  5. MotownPride

    MotownPride Starter 2x Fantasy Champion

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    Especially since there are teams that attempt what Flip is preaching, are much better at it, and still come up short. At some point, the drop we are going to take defensively will become a marquee topic of discussion. I think the Detroit media has done an excellent job of convincing the masses that offensive dominance will cure all of our woes. If I listen to the papers, the drop we are going to see defensively is not a big deal with the "new rules". I'm not drinking the kool-aid. My guess is after the first month of the season our drop in defense from the Larry years to present day will be glaringly obvious. My gut tells me that we will go from an average defensive team to a slightly below average defensive unit before the year is done. That's a formula I don't see us going very far with in the playoffs, but I'd love to be proven wrong.

    I don't see regular season wins being an issue for Flip, so I think his job is safe this year....which is ultimately to our detriment. If only the championship was determined during the regular season, we would be one of the favorites.
  6. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    Try eating less salt and getting more exercise. :D
  7. professor

    professor Bench Warmer Forum Donor

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    hey hack, it's not that i have a problem with your opinion of flip... i'd agree with those who feel he's given us plenty to question and be concerned about.

    my problem is with the equation: don't hate flip = not real pistons fan. but then, who knows, that might not be what you really meant to say anyway.
  8. hack

    hack First Round Draft Pick

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    I guess it shouldn't really be a referendum on Flip, but in this case he's the catalyst for the offense vs. defense discussion. It's the underlying philosophy I'm talking about, and I do genuinely believe that there's overwhelming evidence backing the defensive side of the debate. My point is that as Pistons fans, we've been in a wonderful position to observe this over the last 3 years, and even back 20 years.

    I wouldn't expect a Suns fan, for example, to get it. Suns fans have never seen something like the Game 6 against Indy in 04, when everyone's shots stopped falling and we were able to lockdown. Such fans have never seen how much fun players can have when they're giving the other team fits and getting fast-break points of turnovers. They don't understand that it's possible to win when the offense is cold. We do, however. We have concrete lessons from the past 3 years that pretty much prove anecdotally and specifically why defense is so much more important than offense.

    So, yeah. It is truly beyond me how any Pistons fan who watched the playoffs could argue with the concept of defense over offense.
  9. easybuckets

    easybuckets First Round Draft Pick

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    All the Flip haters should remember Porters' 30 wins when he got fired. Flip's teams made the playoffs every year but one. Also Flip was loyal to his franchise. If Porter was that good he would have a head coaching job right now. The NBA rules have changed whether we like it or not. Deal with it.
  10. Pwn Toney

    Pwn Toney All-Star Forum Donor

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    Loyalty is worth "0" vicotories.

    Besides, the Pistons won with defensive pressure in 89 & 90. The Pistons won again in 04 with tough defense AFTER the rule changes that came from the Bad Boys. This team should be able to win with defense post the 04 rules changes, but if you give in and stop trying you definitely aren't going to win.

    I don't want my team's fate to be tied to one guy's knee, ankle, back, foot, or any other appendage that will essentially get us 200 FTs a night or flush our season down the toilet. So, apparently, the league is trying to force its way back to the Michael Jordan model. "Get a star and hopefully get enough calls for that star to win yourself a title." Don't have a star you say? Well, better hope you can run and gun your way past teams that do or...
  11. easybuckets

    easybuckets First Round Draft Pick

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    I loved the term yukface! But I think Darko and Ben ight both have it this season. But how do you defend Wades' zillions of whistles and zillions of trips to the charity stripe? You can't breath on the dude without getting the whistle. And I read that the previous season 04-05 that the 3 Players getting the most whistles were Wade, Iverson, and Shaq. How could our fouls increase so much during the playoffs? How could Lebron get away with all the traveling? How could the refs suck so much? And why can Stern arbitraily change the rules every season? Shouldn't there be a vote on these things? Larry Brown also had a pretty good Yukface.
  12. Slippy

    Slippy All-Star Administrator Forum Donor

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    Irrelevant.
  13. Slippy

    Slippy All-Star Administrator Forum Donor

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    Hopefully, the league will learn that a free throw shooting fest is bad for business cuz its utterly boring!!! One can only hope.
  14. professor

    professor Bench Warmer Forum Donor

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    thanks for clarifying your position hack. i get what you are saying now. i certainly do understand on the basis of the past three years all the things you describe above. and i do get the concept of defense being an always reliable mainstay that is fundamental to winning ships and probably still is, regardless of rule changes, etc..

    for me personally, though, your post made me realize something that may well be heretical to utter in this forum: namely that perhaps championships aren't my bottom line. i loved watching the pistons lock down a few years ago. but i also love watching the suns run and run and pass the ball elegantly and creatively and fill it up. i was even able to enjoy and admire the spurs more methodical efficiency on both ends of the court two years ago. of course, i'd rather see the pistons win a title than not, and certainly would rather them win the title than anyone else. but as long as they are playing whatever style they play well, hard, with intensity and passion and as a team, then i'm happy enough. championships are just icing on the cake for me, as far as my fan/viewing experience goes.
  15. OLD SKOOL HQ

    OLD SKOOL HQ All-Star

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    FLIP SUX!!!:gun1: flip's face here...
  16. hack

    hack First Round Draft Pick

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    That's yours to decide, prof, though I do disagree. I want rings. 05 was a great run, but if it wasn't combined with a ring the year before and the expectation that we'd take it back the next year, it would have been difficult.

    Re the matter of taste, I personally find nothing more pleasurable than watching them lockdown. I think a lot of people do, actually. It's so exciting when they're not just scoring but doing it off turnovers that lead to breaks. And I think the players like it too. It's infectious. The funnest quarter of the whole playoffs was the 4th of the Game 7 vs. the Cavs.
  17. Slippy

    Slippy All-Star Administrator Forum Donor

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    reading comments from the game, i am going to change my tune a little. I give flip crap for what he is reported to say but this time around, i liked his focus. Say what you want about the zone, i liked the fact that he was quoted in all the articles talking about the help D, the trapping and giving Carlos and Flip props for their defensive efforts.
  18. himat

    himat Bench Warmer

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    Hopefully he doesn't lose focus along with the rest of the team. To see if this earning minutes thing is true we have to see if Flip will start benching a starter if a sub is doing better than them.
  19. linwood

    linwood All-Star

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    Seriously, my favorite game OF ALL TIME was the Nets game with Kenyon Martin and company throwing a little party for themselves for scoring 71 (on freethrows, no less) against the mighty defensive juggernaut Detroit Pistons!

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