ECF Game 1 Celtics vs Pistons Tues May 20 8:30PM

Discussion in '2008 Playoffs' started by max, May 18, 2008.

  1. lpgrl26

    lpgrl26 Bench Warmer

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    And before the series, all was being preached was how we have to move the ball, even better than we did in any other series. We folded against the Celts defense.

    edited to add;

    The Celtics bench is deeper than us b/c we don't use ours.
     
  2. lapiston

    lapiston Team Captain

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    Warthog:

    That is the game I saw--the one you wrote about.

    I am not happy. Yes, we were in it but it is not that the Celts played that well either.

    It was a bad game considering its the finals and we had so much time off. No flow in the offense is one thing but where was the quickness from fresh legs. And did they scout this team on defense?

    I don't agree with some that Garnett had a good shooting game. He was wide open on most of those shots. If he is let that open, he will always shoot well. Garnett must be slowed down...
     
  3. dba

    dba All-Star Moderator 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    Agree. Gosh darn execution thing.


    Not to be excessively curmudgeonly, but the Celtics bench played 47.9 minutes while the Pistons bench played 56.8. If CB had played similar minutes to the other starters the bench contributions would have been about even. (Which isn't to say that the Pistons bench isn't better nor to imply that they should not play more then the Celtic's bench.)
     
  4. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    It would be nice to have a defensive gameplan that focuses on taking away KG's sweet spots. He has a couple favorite zones and likes to fall into a pattern of J's. We need to dislodge him from those spots.

    He seems to be able to shoot over any defender (Ben Wallace and Sheed in his last 2 games especially). When we put Amir on him, KG was smart enough to muscle him down low.

    The only thing that I can think of is to poke him in the stomach when he shoots.
     
  5. Dumars4Ever

    Dumars4Ever Bench Warmer

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    Anyone complaining about the bench not seeing more minutes in this game obviously won't be convinced by any more arguments the other way, but I'll just point out that on the road, in the playoffs, the best you can realistically hope from your bench is to equal the other team's production. Even the best teams count on their role players to play better at home while knowing they aren't as likely to produce on the road. It really is that simple.

    Bench stats in Game 1:

    Pistons: 14 points, 9 boards, 3 assists, 1 turnover
    Celtics: 15 points, 8 boards, 5 assists, 0 turnovers

    That's about even, which effectively means "advantage Pistons," since the game was in Boston. The starters have to put you over the top, which obviously did not happen last night.
     
  6. lpgrl26

    lpgrl26 Bench Warmer

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    Ben did a fantastic job of this.
     
  7. lpgrl26

    lpgrl26 Bench Warmer

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    Let me rephrase that, we don't play the right players on the bench.
     
  8. dba

    dba All-Star Moderator 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    Poking him in the stomach?

    Anyway, I think you're right. When the Celts went to KG in/near the post three or four times in a row against Ben Wallace in the 4th quarter the other day, Ben stopped him from scoring everytime by getting into his body and taking his legs away. If KG can jump, he can shoot over anybody. If you take his legs away by bodying up, he (and all other big men) becomes mortal pretty quickly. Of course, that assumes he provides the opportunity for the defender to get close.

    If the jump shot is falling though, he is pretty tough to defend since all he does is hang out at 17 feet and wait for his man to help elsewhere. Pretty much the way Dyess scored last night.
     
  9. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    Taking his legs away sounds like a job for Maxiell.
     
  10. lpgrl26

    lpgrl26 Bench Warmer

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    I was just going to say that. You'd think Flip would be aware of this coaching KG all these years.

    Also, apparently Joe D sat down with Flip before the series, and told him to activate Amir which is great and useless all at the same time.
     
  11. CloudWalker

    CloudWalker Bench Warmer

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    I didn't watch last night. I checked over here to see if there was an "X" over number 9....and nope, there wasn't.

    First things on my mind were "lemme guess.... lack of ball movement, half step short on defensive rotations, lousy effort led to uncontested shots for the Celtics. We took jumpers while they took it to the rack."

    Sounds like I was right. It's not because I'm good, it's because thats what these current Pistons are all about.

    I keep reading about what these Pistons do "Historically", or what the "Trend" is.

    Lets be realistic folks.


    Historically, the Pistons won't likely win a championship.

    The Trend is...they lose in the Eastern Conference Finals.

    This is everything I was afraid would happen coming to fruition. This squad (historically) gets just far enough for fans and GM to think the Pistons are still in the upper echelon of the NBA. The major changes needed to put this team back in the NBA finals are once again ignored, and by the time Joe Dumars develops a true sense of urgency our core players have lost the trade value they had just a few years ago when Joe should have started pulling the trigger.

    All the Coach Brown fans should know what I'm talking about here. He saw this on the horizon, and his warnings fell on the deaf ears of Dumars and Davidson.

    We lost Ben Wallace for nothing at all 2 years ago. Don't think that the summer before we couldn't have turned him and Tayshaun into Paul Pierce, or him and Rasheed into Garnett. Or him and Rip into Iverson, or him and whomever into (heaven help us) a lottery pick. I'm not pushing for any of those players in particular, just filling in the blanks with an identity. To break this down into why each one of those guys "wouldn't have worked out" would be missing the point, which is that our "team without a superstar" is about to get trumped by one of three other "superstars that play as a team".

    Joe had the chance to turn two all-stars into a superstar, which in hindsight today (had he included Ben in the trade) would have equated into swapping only one of our current all-stars for a superstar player. He passed on this opportunity, and it is apparent what we are left with everytime the Pistons fail to score for "X" minutes in a row, or struggle to score "X" amount of points in a game, or in the fourth quarter for that matter.

    I know most people don't want to hear this. Alot of you seem to be happy for ECF appearances, well, not me. I see no difference between us and Chicago or Miami, no difference besides the fact that those teams have a better chance of improving by next year, and we have a better chance than they do of being worse.

    Of course, we can keep clinging to the past successes and in the end have nothing to show for any of these players as they get older and fade out of NBA relevance. On the other hand, Joe can start rebuilding this team right now, while some of these players are still considered assets.

    I know what I'd do. I have a feeling of what Joe is going to do this summer after Boston knocks us out of this round convincingly.

    The problem is, Joe is most likely a few years too late. Two of our "all-stars" really isn't worth the same as it was 2-3 years ago.

    Get ready to be rooting for ping pong balls in a few years folks. I'll save you all a seat.
     
  12. LA Dre

    LA Dre All-Star 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    You are right in a lot of your points Cloudwalker, but I am thinking this should have been posted if or when we are ousted...

    I am not happy with last nights results, but as our fearless leader (Microscoe) indicated, the celtics had the best record in the league, the second best home record and although we eeked out or stole the first matchup on their court in November they have owned us defensively now for three straight games...

    Both teams finished 1 & 2 in most of the defensive categories, and all four games have been a struggle. However in the end their so called inexperience has trumped our experience down the stretch as our guys have either not stepped up or their guys have save that extra energy that we seem to be missing. It has been our vets who have folded in the end:yellowprison:..but that's who Flip goes with no matter how bad one of them might be lame, slow or winded....

    I am sitting here now watching the replay on NBA TV and here in the 4th qtr we have gone to the same play (Sheed backing down Perkins) 4 times in a row. The Celtics finally figured it after a time out and cause two straight TO's.
     
  13. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    It's hard to move the ball against good defenses. Trying to force ball movement usually results in turnovers.

    The Celtics were having a hard time against us as well.

    The home teams were like 23-2 in the 2nd round or something like that. No shame in losing a road game to the team with the best record in the NBA.
     
  14. LA Dre

    LA Dre All-Star 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    One thing I for got mention was media hype. With the Celtics going thru two seven games series a lot us got caught up in the they will be tired-we can steal game one syndrome.

    We may not have been prepared for their energy level and will need to exert more ourselves by trying to win it in the first half and not trying to wait until the end to turn it on. Let them play catch-up in the second half by delivering the knockout in the first. (10-12 pt haltime lead should be enough)

    This game was close , but clearly they won the battle of Garnett oever Sheed and Rondo over Billups. Rip and Allen cancelled each other out and as did Dice and Perkins. (Dyess had the points and Perk had the boards and the scowl)
     
  15. st8ofmind

    st8ofmind Bench Warmer

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    It will have to be a shame at some point soon or it will be fishing time.
     
  16. Ernie the Slow Adult

    Ernie the Slow Adult All-Star Forum Donor

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    When is the last DET won a road game in the ECF? Have they ever won one with Flip here?

    I missed the 1st half flying to Hawaii. I am not surprised to hear that thye gave up a 6-0 run to end the half. There are things good teams do and things bad teams do and trend-wise DET is the latter.

    Flip says they're starting there sets with 12 seconds left on the shot clock and need to get it going quicker. This has been going on for 3 years now and this is the first I've ever heard him say it. I will not be holding my breath for any miracle adjustments any time soon.

    They open the 3rd qtr running a play(s) that has Sheed standing 35' from the basket on the weak side. They would pass the ball 3-4 times for a total of 8'. I am not sure what the purpose of this is, but it seems to end with Rip or CB going meekly at bigger defenders hoping they get a call or the tradmark contested jumer as the clock winds down.

    Once again, they start going in to Sheed when they get down big and start getting at least a flow. BOS came to double. Maybe they could get some (Gasp!) open shots from this. Why can't they start out like this?(Can't really fault Stucker here for not calling out the double team. He was probably focusing on spreading his arms like an airplane so he could get called for a weak and 1 on D.)

    They highlight a play where Pierce drives to the middle against 5 defenders and kicked it out to KG for a jumper during the 3rd quarter run. You could look at that and say, 'Wow, look at the Piston D collapse!', but the beauty of this play is that despite abandoning the other 4 players on the court, Pierce was 6' from the hoop and could have easily scored if he chose to.

    The TO's were rust related, but there is more going on here. The C's can cover DET 1 on 1 but DET can't turn the tables on them. This could be overcome if their offense wasn't so bad. To think I was seriously considering not going to Hawaii so I could watch this. I got problems.
     
  17. explosivity

    explosivity First Round Draft Pick

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    I love when posters on here make statements that are objective and not emotional. Thank you Ros and Tashawn. That's why I read about 25% of all the posts on the forum becuase the other 75% are being influenced on how the poster is "feeling" as oppose to the facts. Look guys we are all disappointed that we didnt win last nite. We all thought that we were going to go in there and steal game one after all of that "rest" we accumulated. The "rest" will pay off in the latter part of the series as oppose to the beginninng. All the celtics did was hold serve in the first game of the series, must I remind you guys that there is a game 2 on thursday of which we are perfectly capable of winning. The game was very close for most of the game despite missed open shots, late defensive rotations, missed free throws, uncharacteristic turnovers, and the proverbial "rust."

    We will be fine guys IT IS JUST THE FIRST GAME. There is nothing wrong in making criticisms here and there becuase that is one of the main puposes of a forum. However, if indeed you doomsayers already know the outcome what is the point in even watching this series. Support our squad win or lose, that is what being a true fan is all about. I FIRMLY BELIEVE THAT WE WILL WIN GAME 2 STEALING HOMCOURT AWAY FROM BOSTON. A RARE EXP POST.
     
  18. st8ofmind

    st8ofmind Bench Warmer

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    I firmly hope you are right, but can't even muster flaccid enthusiasm to match that hope.

    funny picture

    [​IMG]
     
  19. dba

    dba All-Star Moderator 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    Remember when everyone said the Pistons were so good at going with the hot hand - running the same play until over and over until the defense stopped it? Who know that the opposite was also true? If something doesn't work the first time, keep doing it until the game is over.

    Didn't matter though, this game was over in the third. The Pistons manage to shoot 50% (39% in the first half) but allow the Celtics to shoot 53%, and turn the ball over seven times (3 for Boston) including three by Rip that pretty much negated his 5-7 shooting. A one point deficit grows to 12 and it's all over but the shouting.
     
  20. st8ofmind

    st8ofmind Bench Warmer

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    Like how Rip hits 1 wide open J to start the 4th and is all of a sudden going 1 on 5 since he's "hot".
     

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