ECF Finals game 5 8PM

Discussion in '2007 Playoffs' started by max, May 30, 2007.

  1. Capn

    Capn First Round Draft Pick

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    One of the things I don't understand is when Tay was heating up in the 3rd quarter, when he kept picking gibson or whoever and got the switch, why did they stop going to that?

    I also don't understand how it is possible that when Lebron was on the bench we didn't pull away? Instead either the Cavs made it closer or we kind of just traded baskets.

    This team is perplexing. This team could be truly great if they decided to be, but it's like they don't want to play the whole game. They just assume they can swoop in and finish the game and leave.

    I agree on the last few "layup" dunks that James should have been fouled and fouled HARD before he could even get close to the rim.

    Nothing we can do now. Now it's up to us to go back to the "Q" and get our home court back.

    The fat ain't singing yet, but she's warming up.

    Let's GO PISTONS!!!! Play like you MEAN it for once!!!
     
  2. lapiston

    lapiston Team Captain

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    The problem is that the Cavs can play with us. Why? They can hold our offense. We don't have penetrators that can take advantage of the rules. We don't pass the ball to burn their doubles. We play one on one basically.

    Le Bron puts a lot of pressure on our defense. He got the key calls on drives last night. That set up the jumper show. During the game, the Cavs run plays off of Le Bron. Their guys get enough looks to keep a lead or stay close. They also drive and take advantage of the rules. So they get to the line. That is how they erase any of our leads.

    Le Bron shouldn't have been allowed to go off like that. There I wonder about the coaching adjustments.

    The Pistons played with a lot of guts. But we are playing at a disadvantage. Now it looks like we can not put out the defensive stops. Things are not looking good.
     
  3. LA Dre

    LA Dre All-Star 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    Yes there was a defensive collapse last night, but in a nutshell your comments state what the real problem is: not enough movement without the ball and everytime somene tries to post up or back their defender to the hoop, there is never any help out on the weak side. The Pistons players are so use to it they don't even look for the help and either force a shot or lose it on a TO.
     
  4. congoman

    congoman First Round Draft Pick

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    I feel my cynical side rising. If one wanted to throw a game wouldn't it be easy to not drive to the hole in the final seconds and take a crazy jump/flip shot instead? Wouldn't it be easy to let the super-star just waltz right in to the hoop for the winning shot without knocking him on his butt and forcing him to make some free throws? Wouldn't it be easy for the refs to conveniently miss a few calls at one end and call touches at the other end? There is something about this series that is just fishy. I know better, but I'm just sayin.:frusty:
     
  5. Warthog

    Warthog Bench Warmer

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    Ugh, what a day. First our team loses in softball, then I lose my sunglasses, the Pistons lose, and I lose my voice. I slept in and took half a day off work, and I'm still having trouble talking...throat is dying.

    Got to the Palace a little early, tailgated with a few friends and had some delicious Tubby's subs, and headed inside. I knew I was going to be annoyed with the two people next to us, because they didn't blow up their thundersticks, sat down during the intros, and generally were there for the atmosphere and not the game. She was really hot though, so that was okay. Apparently her friend was the one who made the $50,000 half-court shot last game, and she said he was rich and didn't need the money. Figures. My buddy explained to me that those corporations don't lose $ on that anyway, since they take out insurance with the bank, and the bank pays about 90% of it if they actually make the shot. Anyway, the crazy old lady who sits in our row - we told her we saw her on the jumbotron last game (we had diff seats), and she mentioned she was worried because she didn't want to be on TV ... apparently she was with a 'friend' and he wasn't her husband. :sssh:

    The atmosphere was a little different this time. Walking around, there were fewer Cleveland fans, and a LOT more fans actually wearing Pistons gear. I saw people bust out Dumars teal jerseys, Mahorn Bad Boys jerseys, anything. It's like the real fans showed up and realized we needed this game. It was hot as hell, especially in the 2nd level, and especially for our two friends who were in the 2nd-to-last row. But if you're looking for bad omens, during the intros the loud BOOM that goes off with the flames didn't sound. Also I was disappointed when Cleveland made the first shot of the game after winning the tip. It's like the games we dominate by 20, the other team needs to miss their first shot and then we're comfortable and play our game. Also what the heck was Larry Hughes doing actually making a couple 3s? We shoulda been up by 10-15 early.

    I thought we were going to roll over the Cavs - no turnovers in the 1st, playing hard, winning all of the stat categories. But Flip made the absolute dumbest coaching decision of the entire playoffs, and I have no clue why. Sheed had 8 points early and was dominating, and with only 7 minutes played he took him out of the game for Dice. WTF?!?!?! The guy who 'we go as he goes' is dominating, drawing fouls, and you TAKE HIM OUT OF THE GAME!?!?

    Anyway, the Dice foul is what really changed the game, and it wasn't because we no longer had his services (which was total bs - if Lebron doesn't charge after Dice like he had just punched Varejao in the throat, he doesn't get ejected). The problem is the whistles stopped going our way, and they started blowing NONSTOP. We suck when the game is called tight and the refs take over, and take over they did.

    I don't want to blame the refs for the loss, but if this against Orlando or Chicago without a superstar to get calls, this is a game we get a blowout victory. In the 2nd quarter, we had 18 points in the paint, 9 second-chance points, and 4 fast break points, only shooting one 3-pointer. Cleveland had shot seven 3-pointers, and had ZERO points in the paint, ZERO second-chance points, and ZERO fast break points. Basically we were attacking and they were settling for long jumpers. We were the aggressor, and they were passive.

    Yet they had 24 free throws to our 22. That p*sses me off more than any single aspect of the game, that the Cavs should've had 10 fewer free throws by half-time, and we should've been cruising into halftime with a 15 point lead. I still cannot get over this, and words cannot describe it.

    Again I don't know why some people (like Natalie on need4sheed.com) or Terry Foster said the crowd was quiet at times. To me it felt like a community of people all pulling together. After the Dice foul, "Let's Go Pistons" chants started out of nowhere and were thunderously loud. The crowd was back. And the f'ing refs ruined it by calling everything the rest of the game.

    I sincerely thought the game was over when we went up 87-81 in the 4th. I sincerely do not understand how you let Lebron tie the game twice in regulation with dunks, playing man defense, and no one guarding the paint. Do you want a potential And-1? Of course not. But foul him before it happens and put the pressure on HIM, especially when your offense isn't triggering. I think Maxiell would've done it, but he got faked out of his shoes by Lebron. I actually don't mind putting Max on Lebron in that situation (like when we put Ben on Lebron and he could actually body him up), as Max had been playing great D on Lebron all series. He just screwed up on that play which was at the worst time.

    As for the end of the game, since when is the best option a Chauncey 3-ball when you only need 2 points, leaving Cleveland enough time for a decent shot themselves? Seriously??? Double-screen for Rip like the 2nd game of the 05-06 season against Boston where we won at the buzzer, and let your best shooter decide the game with an open look, when he was making every free throw in the 4th and in a rhythm. SERIOUSLY. WHY ARE YOU BOMBING A CONTESTED THREE-POINTER WHEN YOU HAD A WHOLE TIMEOUT TO SET UP A PLAY THAT WOULD GENERATE A QUALITY SHOT????

    The overtimes continued some of the worst coaching ever. Not only does the coaching staff not realize that Lebron is the only one scoring, they also don't realize that Gibson and Hughes aren't in the game and you don't care if they're getting open shots or not. Just stop Lebron!! They'd do fine getting the ball out of his hands with a double team, but the Cleveland players would pass it right back and the Pistons wouldn't bring the double team back. I don't understand. I don't understand switching to a man defense in overtime ... at least zone it so you have help down low in case Lebron drives ... and why is Chauncey guarding Lebron in the 1st place? Larry Brown had plenty of coaching blunders, but there's no way the Cavs get more than a game if it's Larry Brown vs. Mike Brown.

    After the game the crazy lady and her friend walked past, said 'see you Monday', and I nodded but you could tell we both believed it would take a near miracle. My buddy and I sat in our chairs and didn't say a word to each other for about 10-15 minutes. We just stared ahead in shock, disgust, anger, disappointment, and disbelief. Apparently TNT captured this on camera, and again if anyone has this Tivo'd, please find a way to send a picture, I'd at least like to see myself on national TV! :P We went back to the parking lot to meet our friends, eat some more food, and wait for the cars to clear. Apparently a lot of people were angry and upset, because our friends witnessed a couple scrums break out in the parking lot. I'm guessing it was Cleveland fans gloating, as they were pretty sore winners and stupidly taunting any Pistons fan within earshot. After awhile we left, I stopped at the bar to meet some friends and have a much-needed beer, and headed home.

    On a sidenote, those of you who weren't there or haven't been to a playoff game like this, I really wish you could be there for that experience, so much so that I'll write this in 2nd person. It's different being in the building, watching live, and being free to yell as loud as you can, clap thundersticks, jump up and down, stand up for great plays, and do it with 22,000 others. You share an experience with so many other people, doing your best to affect the outcome of the game with just your voice, screaming until your voice is gone and then finding a different set of vocal chords that are still functioning and screaming with those. You know you can't stop a Tayshaun turnover, or make a Rip basket go in, or increase Flip's coaching ability, or make Lebron miss a freaking basket, but you yell with every ounce you can anyway, just in case. You experience every emotion imaginable, from elation to relief to anger to despair to hope to apathy to acceptance. You wear the same clothes to every game because they win when you wear them. You see a girl coming back to her seat after hitting the concession stand, yet the Pistons went on an 10-0 run while she was gone, so her friends literally force her to go back down the steps and not come back to her seat. No joke. The hot girl next to you who couldn't have cared less about the game before it started, by the end of the game you see her standing up and yelling as loud as you are, as into the game as you are, wanting the Pistons to win just as much as you do, even if she can't name anyone past the top 7 guys. The fans who normally don't stand unless there's less than 30 seconds to go in the game, you see them stand for the last 3 minutes of regulation and all 10 minutes of both overtimes, including the timeouts. There's truly nothing like it, and you can't experience it watching on TV.

    I was there for Horry's Game 5, I was there for Miami when we lost Game 5 that same year before beating them in 7, and I was there for this Game 5 ... and while all 3 were extremely dejecting losses, I'm still glad I was there to experience them.

    (on second thought, maybe I should stop attending Game 5s...)
     
  6. Dumars4Ever

    Dumars4Ever Bench Warmer

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    Incredible effort on the re-cap, Hog. Next time you do one (maybe not till next season...:doh:), you've earned the right to drop some THIRD person on us!
     
  7. KGREG

    KGREG All-Star

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    Warthog that was just PHENOMENAL.......Now a lil perspective on the game. A few things are obvious, yeah I'm pissed we made no attempt to find out if any Cav not named Lebron could make a shot in the last 16 mins of the game, but guess what... while the Pistons didn't try to find out, neither did the Cavs especially Lebron.

    I mean I know everyone's pissed but don't take for granted just how great of a performance we saw. I saw a kid grow up. I saw the best player make a decision that he was not going to lose. Guys, our team played great ball last night. All we asked was for them to leave it on the court and they did. Webber played EXCELLENT D down the stretch (remember we shut the other TEAM down sans one) it was just a situation where James was not going to lose and it's at that point there was nothing anybody - short of God Almighty - could do about it.

    I love this team and they made me proud last night, yes there were a few things that they should have done differently but that's true for every team after every game, there is no perfect basketball game. After game 4 Billups', "I'm only human dog" response was total BS, but after this game it's right on cue.

    If it takes a player scoring 29 of the last 30 pts, their final 25, to beat my team in double OT by 2 pts, than that says alot about the Pistons.......It literally took a Superman type game to beat us, and as long as my team walked into that lockerroom last night saying that he'll have to do that 2 more times to go to the Finals and begin his era than I say BRING IT!!!!! BRING IT!!!!!!!!!!!!
     
  8. himat

    himat Bench Warmer

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    How will LeBron respond in Game 6? Because it is very unlikely that the Pistons will allow him to what he did in Game 5 again. Will the role players make shots? What I saw in Game 5 was a supporting cast that finally didn't play like they were all stars. Gibson and Sasha were bricking shots. Sheed drew fouls on all of the Cavs bigs, LeBron just carried his team. Will he be able to do it again? Or will the Cavs role players play great again?

    Sheed MUST play well. Pistons just can't win the game without him. I will be very disappointed if Sheed plays bad or has foul trouble.
     
  9. Woody

    Woody All-Star 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    My take:

    The Pistons have been losing playoff games the past two years because they are missing their only Hall of Fame person - LARRY BROWN!!!!

    You may hate him, but he's the only one of the current team who will ever make the HOF.

    We're never going to play at a high enough level under Flip to make it through the play-offs. He gives the team no intensity. Larry did that.

    We have no HOF players so we've got to play at a very high level. Flip ain't that guy, Larry was.
     
  10. basketbills

    basketbills All-Star Forum Donor

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    I agree. A lot of folks dumped on LB because he didn't win the Championship both years. But to be fair to Flip if the Pistons win this series he probably will consider it to be a successful season...let's not assume we are out of it. If only Flip had payed Blalock at backup point....!
     
  11. Woody

    Woody All-Star 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    Blalock at back up point is NOT the answer. I don't think he's our HOF answer.

    More intensity, better plays out of time-outs, more timely use of the bench (and the right substitutions, too), and a host of other little things that make the difference between an average coach, and a HOF coach.

    Forget Blalock, and Amir. They are for next year (Blalock probably never).
     
  12. basketbills

    basketbills All-Star Forum Donor

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    Well...he did hit that three pointer.
     
  13. max

    max All-Star

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    I agree but there has to be someone out there who can coach the big games without destroying the team in the process. For 6-10min/year we should be able to find someone who can lead the team with the best plays possible and not scape goat players. Its not a lot to ask.
     
  14. LA Dre

    LA Dre All-Star 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    Well over 150 posts and not that many that actually indicate that the Pistons played decent last night. CB hit some clutch shots, webber had his best game offensively. They even had a couple of three possession leads that many of us thought was needed to win the game.

    Mike Browns time outs stop those runs and they always had an answer.. The three straight turnovers with under 3 mins when we were up 88-81 was one of the defining sequences that has not been discussed. If one of those possessions had been converted into a bucket, I think we would have won the game.

    In Hog's blog, (which was excellent as usual) he stated that Flip's decision to put in Dice early that led to the flagrant foul was a turning point too. Agree with that, but I heard McCosky say that Sheed asked for a blow, so that is why he went out. However it did affect the officiating from then on.

    Bottomline we played well enough to win the game...but La bron was in a zone and everyone stood by and watched including the fans, Piston players and Cavs. The way those jumpers were falling, he could have beaten anyteam last night whether it was the Showtimers, Bad Boys, Russells Celtics or Jordan Bulls. Some would have challenged the layups, but once we gave him the opening with those 3 turnovers in regulation, he was not going to be stopped.

    Lets assume that the zone is closed on Saturday and he comes back to earth. I expect another close game with our experience winning out.:pray:
     
  15. Lee356

    Lee356 All-Star

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    I will take an occasional brain fart over a guy who just is totally unable to move. Webber continually was just standing around watching while Cleveland drove in. All the experience in the world does not help shot legs. Further, why in the heck doesn't Maxiell have the experience. He came to us as a 4 year college player, physically ready, and he got no time as a rookie-and far too little time this year. It all goes to having a bad coach.

    PS, we have a couple of more young inexperienced players who would be doing much better than certain vets that get to play. You don't play the most experienced player, you play the best player. (And if you are worth a darn as a coach, you identify your best players and play them, making sure they are ready to contribute in the playoffs.-Flip has 4 guys on the roster not playing in the playoffs who could be helping considerably.)
     
  16. TheeTFD

    TheeTFD All-Star

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    Sounds like you were a witness Warts.
    The radio talk sure took off with it. Jordanesk...phenomenal at least they admitted the Detroit D was superior.
     
  17. Warthog

    Warthog Bench Warmer

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    well they have the entire TNT postgame up on nba.com, so i got a screen capture. i'm on the right in the shorts. the other guy is my buddy who has the season tix w/me. needless to say, we weren't happy ... but at least we got on TV :P

    [​IMG]
     
  18. TheeTFD

    TheeTFD All-Star

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    I would've perferred to see the hotties.
    Tell your buddy not to pick his nose in public.
    You're making us all look bad.
     
  19. Warthog

    Warthog Bench Warmer

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    heh, yeah on video it looks like he's biting his fingernails a la lebron but he's just playin w/his gum.

    all the hotties were gone :o
     
  20. TheeTFD

    TheeTFD All-Star

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    You're a big star now.
    At least at PF.com
    Almost as big as Dre
     

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