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Discussion in 'Pistons and NBA' started by max, Oct 28, 2005.
Dupree He does have one year left on his contract so I cannot not see why he could not be traded.
Morning Max, he can be traded but unless we trade two for one, it doesn't solve the roster size issue. I'm not sold on the whole story regarding Hunter and retirement, the if he "retires", clears the Roster spot, but then "un-retires" in the spring story. That we'd in fact be worried about his ability to clear waivers. Who is going to snatch him off the waiver wire after sitting 7 months? Okay the Nets (Rod "babyface" Thorn) might if they're in the hunt and the seeding looks ominus, other than that no one is likely to pick up a 36 year old pg/sg. Retiring him and taking the chance is worth it . It's the smart move with the least amount of risk attached to it. Afterall, Hunter won't be the MVP of any future series.
Dupree G/man. If Dupree is a min contract guy then he can be traded with no salary in return. At least I think he is a min contract. Problem is it would have to happen before Monday. I agree on Hunter. Just an injury - he will be back. I do believe he is only 34yrs old but will be 35 before the playoffs.
Hunter can take the entire regular season off as far as I'm concerend. Just as long as he's ready for the playoffs. We'll need his tough man D against Wade, AI, Tinsley, etc. if we're going to get back to the finals again.
Whats up Max. Hey Max, You are absolutely correct in that Hunter will turn 35 in December. Not exactly an age where most teams are in the hunt for a guy coming in off an injury or that's been "retired" for most of the year. Plus his salary is right around 1.760 mil this season. That's why I don't think we risk much if he "retires" for most the season then "un-retires" later. I'm hard pressed to worry too much about his not passing the waiver wire. Remember he already went through the waiver wire once. From #9 Larry Coons CBA site, “One interesting thing about minimum-salary contracts is that for certain players, the league office actually pays part of their salary. This happens with players who have been in the NBA for five or more seasons and are playing under a one-year, ten-day or rest-of-season contract at the minimum salary.” Dupree signed a two year deal for the minimum which means the above is moot. From #69 Larry Coons CBA site, “The "minimum salary exception" allows teams to acquire minimum-salary players without regard to salary matching under the assigned player exception. For example, a team over the cap can trade a second round draft pick to another team in exchange for a minimum-salary player, even a 10-year veteran earning $1 million.” “When a team acquires multiple players in the same trade, it essentially ignores the incoming salary for all minimum-salary players, as they fall under the minimum salary exception.” “Teams trading away minimum-salary players do count their salaries (the portion not paid by the league as outgoing salary when comparing salaries for trade.” Confusing info, but it seems most of the advantage in trading Minimum Salaried players is on the receiving end of the deal as opposed to the trading away end. It doesn'y clearly state anything about a "give-away" without a forced return of something compensatory. Since Dupree is on a two year deal, the league isn’t paying for any of his salary, therefore I think it all has to be counted in any trade. My understanding, and I could be wrong, is that it’s the two year deal that strips away most of the (cba oriented) benefits when talking about trading him. The two year deal was a tighter deal. Maybe somebody else can help clarify this?
Cap info Always such of a Grey area with these things. Its never a cut and dry rule.
Here's a scenario if Joe D is high on Acker's future: Detroit trades Dupree & Arroyo to Atlanta for Tony Delk. Delk is on his last year of his contract.... saving the team over 3M for Tayshaun and Ben's cause. Delk could buy us some development time for Acker... maybe sending him to Fayetteville to hone his PG skills once Hunter comes back. Worse case is we have a capable backup in Delk this year and we use the MLE for a PG next year (only if Acker doesn't work out). This doesn't mean Arroyo is not the answer here. It all depends on how strongly Joe feels about Acker's long term future.
Could you expound a bit on why you would let Delk play for us? Mercury, this soon to be 32 year old does not seem like what we would want as our backup point. Atlanta gave him just 10 minutes in the preseason I see. In the 2002-2003 season, Delk played significant minutes, 1873 to be exact. He got 654 points and 146 assists that year. This compares to Arroyo's last year with Utah where Arroyo outdid this by quite a bit. In about a hundred more minutes, Arroyo got around twice as many assists, 355 to be exact. And Arroyo put in 897 points. Seeing Arroyo this preseason, where he is slightly outdoing CB in offensive production, (combining points from his assists and his own points) I can't see at all where you are coming from. And this preseason is no fluke. In that season with Utah, Arroyo slightly outdid CB's best year so far as far as combined assists and own points point production.
Lee you missed the primary point... If Joe thinks Acker has the bigger upside. Not that Delk is all that... but he is a very capable defender and can hit close to 42% of his shots ... also a solid 3 point shooter (think bigger Chuckie who can defend). His expiring deal could be valuable and give Acker his chance to play.
I like Acker too, but There is absolutely no reason Acker can't get some playing time even with Arroyo staying. And he does not need that much. Just some here and there to validate what he is working on in practice, and to keep in touch with the flow of the NBA game. Last year, we had Arroyo and Hunter getting minutes behind CB. This is simply no problem. Someday, if Acker gets that good that he can replace Arroyo, then we trade Arroyo. Not until then. No way you would want to go most of this season with Delk. Major step down from Arroyo.
Man, Dupree's quote sounded rather dejected. He worked hard in camp.
Sounds like (given the info in Lee's earlier post in this thread regarding Acker's contract) Dupree knew the writing was on the wall regarding his opportiunity to make the team. If Joe really wanted to give Dupree a shot, he would have just signed Acker to a training camp contract. This would have allowed the team to retain Acker's rights if they decided to cut him. However, Joe closed the door to that option by giving Acker a partially guaranteed contract. This had to send a strong signal to Dupree that Dumars really wanted to find a reason to keep Acker. Dupree probably looked around at the start of camp and surmised that he was the odd man out.
Dupree I didn't think that Dupree sounded dejected. I think that he would rather have the Pistons waive him and potentially double his salary AND get playing time, than make the team... but he was careful to not say that, which was smart. His game is not being showcased here, and ultimately, that would cost him $ when his contract is up, because he would still be an unknown to most teams. I just hope that the Bulls grab him, and not SA.
Yeah WDFN is reporting that it's practically offifcial Dupree is out, but that Joe coculd leave it up to him. WDFN is saying that if Dupree wants to sit and stay fine. It is in Dupree's best interest to be waived. We owe him his $600k no matter what, if we cut him and another team signs him, Like Tashawn already stated, he can double his $$$ and actually play. Milwaukee Lost Desmond Mason, Dupree would fit in great on their 2nd unit in that up tempo game. I could see him outperforming Delfino and Evans win we meet his team, in route to a loss though.
oh, the ironyyyyyy....this will bite us in the butt. I can feel it. He'll either go to a division rival or our new NBA finals nemisis.
depth How great is it that we are fearing playing against the Pistons' 16th man?
Calling him our "16th man" is a bit misleading. We're saving some other guys for the future - not because they can be more productive than Dupree this year. He probably closer to our 12th best player. Hmmm... I guess your point still holds.
When did Dupree become a b-ball phenom? Did I miss it? I've been watching the Pistons and reading all the articles... when did it happen? I was out of town a little while ago for 2 days, was it then? I mean, I've hardly seen the guy play, and I watched almost every game the last two years. Evans has played. Delfino has played. So that give us, Tayshawn, Evans, and Delfino... why keep Dupree? And even if Acker isn't all that, you all have to admit that PG/SG is probably our thinest position. Especially, if Hunter retires. Which brings me to... when did all of this Hunter retiring talk start? Did that happen when I was out of town too?
I'm just nitpicking, but Dupree's salary has been misreported in the local media several times now. It's actually $719,373. Thanks.
So let me see if I'm clear on this. WDFN is more or less saying that Dupree's fate is in his own hands? and by default Acker's fate is in Dupree's hands too? I'm going to have to turn the radio on, that's very curious.
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