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Detroit vs. Portland - Fri. Dec 20th 2005

Discussion in 'December 2005 Games' started by roscoe36, Oct 2, 2005.

  1. Warthog

    Warthog Bench Warmer

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    geezus you guys are harsh, the pistons are playing their 4th game in 5 nights after a double overtime, cut 'em some slack. they played a slower game and made some bad decisions, but they still shot 46% from 3, made 27-29 free throws (shooting 9 more than portland), with 7 less turnovers, and they won the battle of offensive rebounding.

    in short they did what they had to do to win, we're 20-3, and this was the first of 5 straight at home. right now life is good in pistonland.
     
  2. Lee356

    Lee356 All-Star

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    Indeed, the next 8 of 9 are at home

    At the very end of this, we have a back to back. But for a long stretch, mostly home games, and well spaced. Still, there are problems. And even if we won all 82 games this season, it would not help us get past Miami nor SA. We still need Darko. We still need Evans out of the rotation. (and find a role as a defensive specialist for him. Where his spot up shooting will be more effective as it will catch teams off guard.)And we need Flip to trust Delfino more or get yet a different player to play backup small forward minutes. Do something. Forget the record for a bit and get that bench right.

    Now, I will say I am very pleased seeing Delfino out there over and over lately. A big step up from weeks past. That is progress. But the season is really very short. Not that much time really until the playoffs. Flip has yet to install myriads of plays, and at the same time he has to find a bench that works consistently. For now, I say sit Davis on the inactive list and start playing either Acker or Amir Johnson just a bit, along with Maxiell of course.
     
  3. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    To answer the Evans questions, he has been pretty ineffective lately. He always hustles, but looks lost on offense. Except for his potential three pointers, he is basically playing the same type of game as Darvin Ham. Good hustle plays, decent defense, and average rebounding. I think that he could be best in a fast break scheme with Lindsay, Arroyo, Delfino, and Sheed. But I'm not ready to yank him yet. He was the MVP on his Euro team and he was good in the preseason. It may be that they are not running plays for him. Or it may be that he doesn't have the same confidence when he is surrounded by better players.

    I agree with Lee on Dale Davis too. He's not adding much at all. Even if Darko is having a lethargic night, we would be just as well off. It has been 2.5 years now, and DMC has not been given the chance to lose a game for the Pistons. LeBron and Carmelo have been given 180 chances to lose games for their teams, and they are batting about .500.

    At some point, we should give each of the rookies some experience. Not enought to hurt the team, but enough to see how they respond in a real situation. Of course Maxiel is going to shoot the ball in garbage time. I bet in a tight situation in a real game he would be too unselfish. And Acker should at least get a taste before Lindsay comes back.

    But man, the starting five are really pushing themselves. They are motivated beyond belief. We really can't ask anything more out of them.
     
  4. Pastor Flournoy

    Pastor Flournoy First Round Draft Pick

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    I am not sure if he has Piston DNA, but I am kind of wishing we would have traded Darko for Al Harrington. However, I am going to trust JD on this one.
     
  5. TheeTFD

    TheeTFD All-Star

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    I don't know guys. If the bench loses a game or if the starters lose a game, it's going to hurt. You knock Mo but to date he has played 47 less min. than Dyess but has scored more points. This starting 5 is as smooth as a Jaguar. Let's see our underrated bench develope some unity.
     
  6. himat

    himat Bench Warmer

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    Why bench is struggling

    the bench has not been that great this season, but for the past couple of games it's been horrible because arroyo has sucked and he creates plays for most of the players off the bench. maybe when lindsey comesback our bench will get a lot of fastbreak points to hekp us win.:noidea:
     
  7. KGREG

    KGREG All-Star

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    Missed the whole game last night, and had to come here to get the 411. Glad to see Delfino keeps geeting good run, and glad to see we won, after a double OT battle on the road the night before, this win was a blessing. Now against GS we need some pts in the paint, Sheed, Dyess, heck man even Max.....and Ben needs to pound the offensive glass. I agree with most posters who seem a little irked that our front line is not shutting teams down upfront, I mean Joe has invested alot in making sure this team could do that.
     
  8. KGREG

    KGREG All-Star

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    OK I just checked the Box Score and I'm Furious about the BENCH!!!!! This is just rediculous!!!!!! We need to give Spree a chance, or go get MoPete, or Mike James, or Earl Watson, or Al Harrington etc etc etc. I've been one who's felt that our starting five is so good that our bench is going to be marginal at best, but man this production is rediculous............Now those who know me well will understand the magnitude of this statement, Bring Chucky Back you have to!!!!!!! And believe me I can't stand C Atkins personally or professionally.
     
  9. Slippy

    Slippy All-Star Administrator Forum Donor

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    Its pretty tough to contribute or screw up if you never get in the game.

    I don't know if Mike james would be happy playing 11 minutes a night. Neither would Al.
     
  10. jzchen

    jzchen Bench Warmer Forum Donor

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    LOL :laugh:
     
  11. lemonpen

    lemonpen First Round Draft Pick

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    On top of all of that Evans is messing up on D also. Last night Arroyo should not have been the only one back in transition to perform what is becomming the all too commonplace AND1. Mo sagged into the lane looking for an O board off of a Ben TO or miss (can't remember which), surrendering his position up top. But, Mo wasn't alone in bench sucking.
     
  12. detteam

    detteam All-Star

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    I think we could find MJ 20-25 minutes by swapping CB to the 2 & Rip to the 3 occassionally...it would give Tay a few minutes off AND might be a blast to watch. :eyebrows:
     
  13. mercury

    mercury Bench Warmer

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    Mo Evans is the reason we haven't been playing good "D" in the paint... he's also causing our bigs to miss rebounds... see he forgot to shower again and he's scaring the boys outta the paint... Noone else on the bench has any problems...It's Mo's fault!
     
  14. TBird

    TBird First Round Draft Pick

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    Merc

    In all seriousness, obviously Evans is not the source of all of our problems.

    My question was geared more at whether Delfino ought to be seeing more time than Evans. Except for his offensive rebounding, I don't see Evans contributing a lot. He's scoreless in the last two games and the Pistons' post-game host after the Memphis game mentioned that he looked "lost" out there.

    He really isn't much of a ball-handler or passer and his defense frankly hasn't been much better than CD's. He is also not able to create shots for himself. That being the case, it would seem that Delfino, who can at least handle and take his guy off the dribble, might be the better option.

    Since I'm listening to the games on radio, I would like to know if someone watching can give an objective viewpoint about what they're seeing that may differ from what I am hearing and looking at in the box score the next day.
     
  15. Abe Froemen

    Abe Froemen First Round Draft Pick

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    tbird

    isnt lee's recaps enough to sway your opinion ?????:) no well i am in the same boat as you having only seen like 4 games and listening to the rest but imo delfino should be getting the minutes not mo.
     
  16. professor

    professor Bench Warmer Forum Donor

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    TBird

    I've seen every game on except for Utah and last night. From what I can see, I have to say that Delfino certainly looks more comfortable out there on both offense and defense, and not just individually, but as part of whatever group he's out there with (though especially with some combination of 2 or 3 starters). And this seems to improve with every game. I really like Mo's energy, on the one hand, but it seems that it too rarely actually translates into results. He's reminding me a little bit of Ronald Dupree. Both are players I liked because their athleticism and energy always brought the promise of something about to happen, but then neither really made it happen with enough consistency. So in my opinion Delfino should definitely be getting more of Mo's minutes. In fact, I'd say Delfino could be getting as many as 25 mins a game subbing in different combinations for Rip and Tay. There'd obviously be a drop off, but I really don't think it would even amount to costing the Pistons a game.
     
  17. Lee356

    Lee356 All-Star

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    Evans

    Some people may not want to hear this, but I thought I would point out one thing Evans did that completely baffled me. He was guarding a guard out on the left baseline, and inexplicably just left the guy. The guy nailed a shot, uncontested. Just what did Evans think he was doing on that play? Now, I have seen a guy like Ben Wallace back off from a guard figuring to position for the rebound instead, but look, we are talking about Mo Evans here, not a center. He had no business curling into the paint as his guy went to the corner. Anybody else see this and have any theories on why Mo did this? (Besides simple incompetence)

    I like Delfino, but I also think the Pistons should explore other possibilities for backup small forward minutes. Even using Amir Johnson some. Maxiell is a guy I'd like to see out there, recomprising Corliss' old role as a dominant small forward.

    Here is the bench I envision at the moment: Arroyo, Delfino, (Maxiell and Johnson sharing minutes at backup small forward), Dyess, Darko.

    Both Maxiell or Johnson would give us better rebounding vs. Evans. (Not that Evans has not been doing good on offensive rebounding.) Amir Johnson is much more polished a basketball player, despite his young age, vs. Evans, from what I can see. At least in the summer league, what I saw were snap decisions from Amir Johnson and consistently good decisions. The guy had an 8-9 game where he simply did not take bad shots. (Except he did one time test his range a bit and missed. All his inside shots he nailed. He knew instantly when to shoot, when to pass. Impressed the heck out of me.)

    Maxiell would give us less perimeter D than Evans, but you know what, not that much less. Sure, you put a shooting guard at small forward and Maxiell is going to have to leave the perimeter D to someone else. But he is not that slow, and has great hops with timing and instincts about when to stay home and when to go up. For absolute sure he is going to provide more interior D than Evans. Maxiell is a swat machine, and has great strength. On ball handling, not much there. But since he can post up, it does not matter. He would be a good, consistent offensive weopon for us just from his postup game, freeing up the perimeter just by that.
     
  18. himat

    himat Bench Warmer

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    Dont understand

    i have to agree with you there, but what i don't understand is why the bench is doing so bad, arroyo and dice would be good starters on other teams. darko is actually a second pick, and delfino and evans are good too. it confuses me.
     
  19. MotownPride

    MotownPride Starter 2x Fantasy Champion

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    Mark me down for Delfino being ahead of Evans in the pecking over. Defensively Evans has definitely been a letdown. I think Evans might be a better fit on a team like Phoenix where the offense is more wide open and screens are the norm since he does appear to have difficulty creating his own shot. I agree that he seems to have become very Dupree like in effectiveness. I don't think that Amir Johnson is the solution though. He needs more development. Delfino has earned an opportunity to have a more prominent role with the team. I really like the intangibles he brings to our squad: outside shot, ballhandling, offensive creativity. (Credit bballj for his hindsight on Delfino's potential)

    Frankly, I think the identity and success of the second unit will be more solidified once Delfino becomes a regular in the rotation. I think Flip is slowly beginning to sour on Maurice (playing time is slowly decreasing), so a Delfino push may happen sooner than we may expect.
     
  20. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    What about Lee? He's all about Delfino.
     

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