Dallas Jan. 23rd, 7:00 PM

Discussion in 'January 2009' started by Dlev59, Jan 19, 2009.

  1. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    Except for the fast break points, we had more points in the paint tonight. So we had that going for us.

    Did you see the power moves Kwame was making in GT in the post? He's our only big that does that. And he plays D, so may as well find some time for him every once in a while.

    This game just got away from us. Dallas was hitting a lot of contested shots and we were as sloppy as we've been all year with the ball.

    A really bad stat is that our starters had 5 assists tonight.
     
  2. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    Dirk was hitting contested shots. That's about all you can do when you guard him. He stayed hot the rest of the game too.
     
  3. lapiston

    lapiston Team Captain

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    Tayshaun,
    ]
    Dirk was comfortable out there. One can't let a shooter of his quality have his way. He will hit those shots all the time if he is in his comfort zone. Amir had no answer for him. Maybe next time. But when are the young bigs going to produce game after game? The time is now. Sheed and Dyss are aging...
     
  4. lpgrl26

    lpgrl26 Bench Warmer

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    You asked me specifically why i thought it would work. Do you think Curry would have resorted to SB if CB was here? This incessant shuffling is due to having two SG's. And as for the guys getting older most of them still look the same to me. The only one who's noticeably slower is Sheed and he wasn't until he got injured.

    I'm not saying it would have been 100% perfect; just that the results would be alot better than what we see now and i don't think that's a reach.

    The best option would have and was Max. It's pretty much known if you put a smaller guys who can hold position and crowd Dirk that's much more effective than anything. max plays him similar to the way Ben Wallace use to.
    It has nothing to do with Flip. This is a completely different team. I know you don't want to accept that one player can make that big of a difference but it did. Also the young guys that we depend on now never got PT under Flip. This team would be much better than they were under Flip when it counts if they had a comparable line-up. This team could still be much better than what they've shown if Curry made better use of his personnel.
    That's a cop-out excuse for Curry. He didn't feel compelled to put Rip in when we were playing fantastic in the 3rd quarter against TOR. AI doesn't have to play 40 min. Curry favors him. I don't think that's a question at this point. He's taken Carlisle's love for him and paralleled the situations. If AI is not playing well, there is no need for him to be in the game just like there was no need to sub Rip in that 3rd quarter. When he was interviewed he was talking about having to make the hard decisions. So far he seems to have fell on one decision while trying to placate everybody 99% of the time.
     
  5. adonis

    adonis First Round Draft Pick

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    Oh man, people have a very short memory. You may want to go and check the comments on that trade.
     
  6. 2Tough4You

    2Tough4You Bench Warmer

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    I couldn't agree more. Curry almost makes me long for the days when Flip was coaching this team... that's pretty sad indeed.
     
  7. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    You ever heard of this Dirk Nowitzki guy? He averages 26.0 points per game, which is coincidentally what he scored tonight. I don't think it is a bad sign if our 21 year old first year starter holds a future hall of famer to 15 points over a 22 minute stretch.

    Dirk is comfortable because he's 7' tall and has one of the best jump shots in the league.

    His last 5 games before this were 44, 20, 39, 24, and 30. Last game Dirk shot 17 free throws and in this game, he shot 1.

    Amir did his job by not fouling Dirk and forcing him to take contested shots. Dirk did his job by knocking them down.


    The real story here IMO is that Dirk is a weak defender and Sheed only managed 2 buckets against him. A 4 point outing after last game's 3 point [STRIKE]outing [/STRIKE]pouting.
     
  8. Lee356

    Lee356 All-Star

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    Who was guarding Dirk? Amir. And after Dirk made some shots, who was guarding him? Amir was. Amir managed to stay in the game for the first 10 minutes, guarding Dirk. That was pretty good. With just a few minutes to go in the 2nd quarter, it was virtually a tie game. JMAX was found to be pretty darn effective guarding Dirk. In all, we were containing Dirk well enough, plus we had a lot of bench players in. Things were going good.

    From there, even Curry is questioning what he did at that point. Still not the same as just saying "I goofed". Look, Curry goofed, plain and simple. For whatever excuse he wants to come up with, he took the guy who was finally containing Dirk off of Dirk, and that was bad coaching. I do not care who is on the team, you just don't do that. Curry knows it. But until he says, and very clearly, "My bad" we are in trouble.

    What would Carlisle have done? Back when he was our coach, we had the highest scoring bench in the league one year. Carlisle believed in leaving his bench in, right until the end of the 2nd quarter, if things were going well. Curry was on that team. You would think he would have learned something. No, AI did not have to return to the game. And even if he did, no, there was no reason Rip had to stay out there. He had done his job, to provide scoring punch off the bench. He is now a bench player. He is on the bench because we have two fine shooting guards, and there is often not room to play both of them together. Live with it, deal with it. The other option, to sit Stuckey, would not have been terrible either. Gee, three options to choose from, and he chose door number 4. Nobody gave him that as a choice. Door number 4 loses. Avoid it. Own up to the mistake and don't repeat it next time.
     
  9. 2Tough4You

    2Tough4You Bench Warmer

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    The motto of the team was "Goin to Work". This team is the total antithesis of that.
     
  10. 2Tough4You

    2Tough4You Bench Warmer

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    This is all true. People shouldn't be tearing Amir down because I thought he did an excellent job on Dirk.... Dirk usually gets to the line about 7-8 times a night, but I believe he was held to one free throw attempt tonight. Dirk just made a lot of heavily contested jumpers; he's a hell of a shooter.

    It's the defense that the rest of the team played on Dallas' role players that was simply inexcusable. The effort was not there at all.
     
  11. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    Just looked at the game flows. Not pretty from a strategic standpoint.

    We played 21:24 of small ball and it was -18 for the game.
    We played 26:26 of big ball and it was -3 for the game.

    It's pretty ridiculous at this point. Remember that 14 mpg of SB was MC self imposed limit when we were starting the game with it. He never came close to meeting it, but then when he shifted away from the SB philosophy completely and split up the SG's, it was supposed to be minimal. MC seems to be spending most of his time on the sidelines trying to appease AI and Rip, both in terms of minutes and plays run for them.

    Here are the stint breakouts for SB:

    Q1
    0:42 (-1)
    1:31 (E)

    Q2
    4:40 (-2)
    3:36 (-10)

    HALFTIME (MC logs on to PF.com to get advice)

    Q3
    4:30 (-3)

    Q4
    3:34 (-5)
    2:27 (+3)
    0:24 (E)


    Afflalo is not a suitable backup for Prince. We need to pick-up a defensive SF for cheap or through trade. Ditch Herrmann.
     
  12. Menace

    Menace Bench Warmer

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    Funny cause a few days back when we won the game against the Raptors ppl were posting about how the team and players looked like they were enjoying themselves again. How we got some of the "old" Pistons back.
    Pistons just weren't into the game tonight, didn't have it Period.
    They messed up, played badly, sh*t happens sometimes. Dallas lost to Milwaukee big time and now they win big time against us.
    Next game, new game, give it another try.

    PS.
    MC makes the change to a bigger lineup and everyone is happy, just untill we loose then suddenly it's all gone and nothing is good enough.
    Fans are never happy i guess unless Pistons win.
     
  13. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    I have a very specific comment and it was probably discussed in chat after it happened.

    We got the ball back with 3.3 seconds left in the 2nd quarter after Dallas turned it over by stepping on the line on an in-bound. So, none of our players go to pass the ball in. The ref waves and our guys sort of look at eachother. Finally, Rip (our best jump shooter) volunteers to inbound the ball. He throws it in to Maxiell (one of our worse jump shooters) for a 15 foot baseline fade away and a very bad miss.

    Not sure who was directing that mess.
     
  14. FreshPrince22

    FreshPrince22 Bench Warmer

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    This one was over the second Curry went with the Dice/Prince front court in the final minutes of the first half.

    And while Bynum certainly wasn't the problem, I don't see how Curry can keep playing him. He'll have AI, Stuckey, and Prince out of the game for a big chunk of the 2nd all at the same time, then he puts them all back out there to end the half, but keeps Rip on the floor because he feels bad about the minutes. Bynum not playing is the obvious answer. Let Iverson and Stuck split those 10 minutes he got in the first half tonight, then you don't have to feel bad when one of them ends the half on the bench. Goodbye Small ball.
     
  15. The Palace Artest

    The Palace Artest First Round Draft Pick

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    This season can't end soon enough.
     
  16. Delfino Delivers

    Delfino Delivers Bench Warmer

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    Amen my Brutha!!

    We have enough problems with MC;s rotations as it is. There is no need for him to be trying to get Bynum some playing time UNLESS HE KNOWS THERE IS A DEAL COMING DOWN THE ROAD THAT WILL BE ELIMINATING ONE OF THE OTHER GUARDS.[/I] :idea:
     
  17. NYPistonFan729

    NYPistonFan729 Bench Warmer Forum Donor

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    I did not see the game, but your recap told me all I need to know. Game after game, curry displays a shocking lack of game management skills. The change has to start with curry. He is not ready to be a head coach. The fans are paying thousands of dollars to see on the job training. Dumars should be ashamed.
     
  18. CloudWalker

    CloudWalker Bench Warmer

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    So it has nothing to do with having inconsistent bigs, none of which can be counted on for 10 rebounds (aside from perhaps Antonio) or more importantly, 20 points, no matter how much time they get on the floor?

    Hasn't it occurred to you at least once that perhaps Curry throws Tayshaun in at the 4 because he feels that it's a better option than watching Amir, Kwame, or Jason let him down on the offensive end? It has to me, and it makes much more sense than this SG business. Bottom line is, AI or Chauncey, we still end up with a bigger crop of great quality backcourt players and a slew of one dimensional garbage men occupying the frontcourt.

    We can rationalize what these guys give us defensively all day long. We can even theorize some mysterious number of points that the defense may or may not translate into on the offensive end, but at the end of the day none of them are offensive threats with the ball in their hands, and it makes this team very predictable (perimeter oriented) whether it's Chauncey and Rip, Chauncey and AI, AI and Bynum/Stuckey/Damon Jones...whoever.

    We can even best case scenario Amir into this Ben Wallace type intangible master all fans hope he can be/will be/ is.
    Unless Rasheed is having one of his rare low post scoring threat games we're basically trotting out a frontline of, say, Ben Wallace,Tony Battie, and Bo Outlaw proportions.
    That lineup right there would be horrible if they were all in their prime, yet thats pretty much the kind of talent we are running with right now (at the risk of grievously offending Ben, Tony, and Bo) whilst trying to disguise the lack of balance with rotational hoodoo and countless speculation. Chauncey wouldn't fix that any more than Allen has. We have no inside threats at the 4 or 5. Teams have figured it out, so they play us for the drive and dare us to take jumpers.

    Just like they did last year when Chauncey was here. So it's not like him or Rip or AI are the problem, it's more likely that Joe didn't address the right area.

    All we can hope for now is that perhaps he was looking to address the right area with an all-star break trade (for those of us still wanting to win it all this year) or this summer with the cap space he created.
     
  19. CloudWalker

    CloudWalker Bench Warmer

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    I'm too lazy to go a few years back (I don't even know if it's possible to check game thread from that long ago now) and look for the times you have praised Tayshaun for his defense on Dirk, to the point of him being the perfect guy for the job.

    Now he's useless and outmatched.

    It might have even been on the news forum (and lost forever) but we both know you've done it, and I'm not going to perpetrate this current browbeating of the truth.
     
  20. CloudWalker

    CloudWalker Bench Warmer

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    I'm waiting for Joe to drop a few more bigs so next year people can claim we lose games because Tayshaun is too tall and slow to play three and Curry should know better than to play him out of his natural 4 position.

    yup, I'm predicting MC will be here this time next year.

    Get used to hating him in vain Pistons fans.
     

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