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Home Cleveland Cavaliers - Sunday, April 24, 2016 GAME 4

Discussion in '2016 Playoffs' started by roscoe36, Apr 14, 2016.

  1. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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  2. Ernie the Slow Adult

    Ernie the Slow Adult All-Star Forum Donor

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    Golf clap. They had a hack of a year!

    The Cavs are on a different level. That didn't mean the Pistons couldn't compete, it just meant they couldn't win.

    It was both exhilarating and frustrating.

    What was the reason Drummond didn't play down the end today?

    I think the Pistons figured out who they are now. Big and long. They got to get Drummond help at the PF. (This is the one position I might spend some $$ on in FA if the right guy came along.)

    Great season everyone.
     
  3. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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  4. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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  5. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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  6. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    SVG handled Dre as well as he could in this one I thought. Good move getting him in at the start of the 4th to at least get 6 minutes out of him before the bonus. And it was refreshing to see the small ball at the end for the come-back attempt. The downside of that is of course, the rebounding... but what can you do. A couple more rebounds or loose balls and we take the game.

    I think that the team got about as much out of this experience as if they would have won a game or two and had been blown out in a few. i.e. just being competitive in 4 out of 4 makes them think that they are close and hopefully motivates them to get better. The only problem is that the Cavs really aren't the gold standard- they are the 3rd best team in the NBA at best. Maybe not even that, we'll see.

    Other takeaways from my perspective:

    - that was the best defense the Pistons have consistently played all year. Reggie was putting in greater effort and doing a better job of challenging shots. Same with Dre. And the whole team seemed to be more on a string than usual. Not too many wide open attempts, except when we purposefully doubled and they beat it with good passing. Also, we allowed very little penetration. The Cavs basically beat us from the perimeter.

    - when the going got tough, the Pistons turned to their mid range game a lot and it worked. Tobias, Morris, and Reggie J all got relatively easy 2's in several key instances when a desperate team would have been looking to force a 3.

    - I haven't looked it up, but I wouldn't be surprised if our starting 5 was positive while on the court together this post season. If true (or if not that false), that is a tremendous sign for us. It's not like the Cavs are deep- they are a Lebron/ starter heavy team. If our starters match up this well against them with all our youth and lack of experience, we may be even closer than we think to contending.

    - Our method of winning was taken away from us in this series. All year long, we have has lower efficiency than our opponents, but we have made up for it by gaining extra possessions on the offensive glass and limiting second chance points on the other end. We just faced an opponent that turned the tables on us and it hurt. Trying to get rebounds from Tristan Thompson, Kevin Love, and Lebron is more than one man can do.

    - In a 4 game playoff series, we just got 1 made field goal from our backup point guard. 0-0 in game 1. 0-2 in game 2. 0-1 in game 3. 1-2 in game 4. 44 total minutes and was -24. The team was -10 in the 148 minutes without him on the court. The only way that a superstarless team like us should expect to beat a big 3 model like the Cavs is if we win the depth/ bench war. In this case, our bench got creamed. While we might very well have not made it to the playoffs with Jennings still on the team, I would have loved to see us bring off a scoring weapon off the bench in this series. Our 5 starters look to be set for next year, so hopefully this is the piece that we add. [would Will Bynum have been so terrible in this??? I'm guessing he might have scored a couple].

    - Reggie J looks very immature with his ref comments post game. Might be different if this were a game 7. But he leans into a guy when every one in the arena knows that he was angling for a foul and gets off a weak 3 when down by 2 at home after chewing up all the clock due to being harassed by his defender. Bad play. And he's acting like the official "missed" the call. He saw it and said "nice try."


    - Dre spent all off season last year improving his post game. He did and that was one of the biggest one year improvements that I've ever seen from an NBA player in a specific area. Maybe Rip's 3-point shooting that one year and Lebron's post improvement that one year are comparable. So, the dude has dedication and coordination. So... which area of his game is he going to radically transform this off season? Pick setting? Shot blocking? 3-point range? Any other guesses?
     
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  7. coynejeremy

    coynejeremy All-Star Administrator 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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  8. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    Irving reached in and committed what is usually called as a foul. Reggie also attempted to jump sideways into him as he got off his shot. Everybody does it, so I'm not really trying to knock him. Would have been nice to have a timeout, but we used them to stop runs and to avoid a jump ball.

    You think that the refs are going to put Reggie Jackson on the FT line to WIN a game against Lebron on a last second 4th quarter desperation shot? The only way he gets the call is in a this situation would be if he pump fakes and gets the defender to give him an obvious concussion. The catch 22 is that in any scenario where he gets the call, he wouldn't be physically able to convert the FTs.
     
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  9. Laimbrane

    Laimbrane All-Star Forum Donor

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    Someone needs to re-photoshop this with LBJ's bubble having Stanley Johnson in it.
     
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  10. coynejeremy

    coynejeremy All-Star Administrator 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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  11. brofmfa

    brofmfa Team Captain Forum Donor

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    The Cav. won totally 34 points on us in four games, going forward deeper they will be in big trouble come June.
     
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  12. lapiston

    lapiston All-Star

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    Good, good, good. The team really competed. They didn't always compete in the regular season. Still think this team should have been where the Celtics or Hornets were record wise. But they sure competed and showed who they are.

    The playoffs are brutal and show all your flaws (and your strengths). Blake, like Ily, is a stopgap player. Baynes did not compete at the necessary level. Andre's free throws cost about 5 point a game. The bench, other than raw rookie, Johnson, is not ready for prime time. The team needs bulk to throw against a guy like Love. The team is very young and make some bad plays. The Cavs scored like 15 points in four games on out of bounds plays.

    The Pistons are a tough and versatile group. The future is bright. But an organization that has won three championships cannot be content at .500 and the first round. So the next section will be for those of us who want more. If you are content with a good season, probably ignore the following.

    To move forward, we must be brutally honest with where the team is at. Easy one. The three point shooting is sub-par. Every one of the starters (not Andre) must be a better three point shooter. That sequence in the 4th where the team clanged three after three was not a fluke. It starts with Reggie. He is not a good enough three ball shooter. He hesitates to shoot over the pick and they use the bulk of their defense to stop the pick and roll. Now many blame Reggie for the offense. I am not going there. The main problem is not with Reggie. Many blame the defense and not the offense. Sure as far as defense, a bulky player in the rotation to stop a Love. Andre absolutely must learn to roam. He must be taught that. He is not protecting the rim to this abilities. Not enough of crashing the boards by others as the Cavs loaded up on Andre as far as rebounding goes. But the main problem was the offense.

    The Pistons really could muster about 90 points a game. Not enough. They could not keep the Cavs under 100. Even with the defensive improvement, the offense isn't good enough. Sure, Dre will develop some more offensively. The forwards were great. Harris made the adjustments and he and Morris could drive at will on the Cavs exposing a major weakness (mainly Love). The forwards were great.

    But the problem is that there is no offensive threat from the 2 guard. I know Pope is revered by many. He is a nice complementary player. Some may say, well, Pope scored a lot. He did hit a big three in game four. He missed a designed wide open look in game three with the score 85 to 80. But the issue is not his average three point shooting. When their defense loads up on Reggie, Pope cannot provide an outlet. If the ball goes to Pope on the side, unless he is in position to shoot immediately, it usually is a bad possession. Jackson is not good enough to carry the team alone. Andre is not ready to carry the offense. We can't ask for more from the forwards who drived at will against the Cavs. The Pistons need a bona fide scorer at the 2 guard, someone who is a sharp shooter, someone who can handle the ball, someone who the defense has to fear. Unless, the team uses Pope like Rip used to be used around screens with a catch and shoot pattern, the 2 guard is currently a non-threatening spot in the offense.

    If you look at every game, the Pistons should have been up 10 to 12 points early. But they were only up like four. It was the offense that did not produce. What looks like a defensive problem mainly, is really an offensive problem mainly.
     
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  13. basketbills

    basketbills All-Star Forum Donor

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    I was watching the Celtics/Hawks last night...with Jonas and Amir starting. Even though Avery Bradley is out, I think the Pistons have comparable talent.
     
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  14. max

    max All-Star

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    Oh well its done. Thanks Pistons for a fun year. Too bad we could not have taken the series to at least 5 or 6 but what can you do. Hopefully we can get Dre back and add onto the team. I am thinking that mid-season trade that was voided could have really came in handy that series as we always seemed to be overmatched in the scoring dept. But at least we have a ist round pick to look forward to.
     
  15. BallDon'tLie

    BallDon'tLie All-Star 4x Fantasy Champion

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    Cleveland takes a cleaver and hacks up our playoff chances.
    ...some observations:
    • I'm thinking that these four games were productive. They most certainly will contribute to filling up the knowledge/experience bank for our young Pistons. The Pistons just climbed a rung on the ladder to a championship. Our guys played tough for the better part of four games against the team that will likely represent the EC in the NBA finals this year. No shame in that.
    • For the most part, I thought Stan VanGundy had a good series.
    • Watching Dre Drummond go 5-10 from the stripe makes it seem like a different game. I thought Andre played some "playoff basketball" in this series. I'm signing the "Keep Andre in Detroit" petition as soon as someone hands me the clipboard.
    • Reggie played well in this series. His defense yesterday might be some of the best D I've ever seen him play. I did a double-take a couple times when he was fighting through screens. - His effort was there!. On offense - aside from some dumb turnovers and sheer stupidity on the final play, Reggie did a good job of setting up his teammates.
    • I really like @LA Dre@LA Dre assessment: "Reggie needs to learn how to be the leader and not the hero."
    • On the final play- Reggie had a head of steam and he had Kyrie on his hip; why not take it all the way to the cup and play some overtime (at home). Me (a casual internet fan), shouldn't have a better perspective than a guy making $80 million bucks to do just that (time & score Reggie!!!).
    • Stanley Johnson is a good defender. During a few brief stints, he did a better job on Kyrie Irving than anyone else did all series. He also played LeBron better than anybody else (with the exception of Dre - who tended to shut LeBron down every time he was switched onto him).
    • Seemed like the Cav's got all of the 50/50 loose balls in this one. Marcus Morris needs to fight harder for these damn things.
    • Baynesie sucks. - lee was right all along.
    • Steve Blake killed us. - Once again, Matt Dellavedova metaphorically kicked Steve right in the grill. It's ironic that the "old veteran" looked like the biggest rookie. He played like freaking Spencer Dinwiddie in game 4.
    • The half-court dagger from Irving at the end of the 3rd was the one that won it for the Mistake by the Lake. The Cav's went on a little run after that. The Pistons tried but could not quite recover from that run.
    • My only criticism of Gundy - Kevin Love is not good at defense. Should have picked on him more.
     
  16. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    A lot was made after game two that lebron scored on all 6 shot attempts when stanley was guarding him... Even though they were all tough makes. Then total silence as lebron goes about 0-12 against him the rest of the series.
     
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  17. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    Yeah, sounded like sour grapes. Not classy and probably not smart. I hope the league nails him with a monstrous fine to teach him a lesson.

    And that is what he needs to take away from this. You have to win the game, no one is going to help you do it.

    I agree. I like KCP's defense which was spotty at times late in the season and in the playoffs, but he is too inconsistent. You cannot win games with a 2 guard who gets a fast break dunk once or twice a game. You need consistent production.

    Thomas is an elite player. We don't have one on that level.
     
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  18. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    SJ was who we hoped he would be. I am still super happy about the pick.

    Someone who can play LBJ tough is essential in our division and conference.
     
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  19. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    This is a good critique.
     
  20. BallDon'tLie

    BallDon'tLie All-Star 4x Fantasy Champion

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    I wish we had a game 5 to look forward to.
    I really enjoyed watching the "playoff" version of this team compete the way they did.

    I can't wait until next season!
     

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