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Discussion in 'Pistons and NBA' started by blueadams, Mar 7, 2014.
I definitely agree with this. Find someone with a vision and allow him/her to make moves.
What team in the NBA has 4 quality bigs?
Can you name 3 teams in this league with "4 quality bigs"? It's like you haven't read any posts on this forum the last 4 months.
This team needs a point guard it can rely on echoing some of the comments of others. It is not that tough. The Piston guards do not shoot well at all, they do not stop penetration and they do not get into the lane to play havoc with the defense (I wouldn't give much credence to Bynum's drives as having a positive impact overall). The Piston guards have played sub-par all year. A new GM should systematically trade players from the losing era to create a new culture around Andre. I would keep Monroe but not if trading him is the only option to upgrade at the guard positions. The Pistons cannot win next year either if the guard play does not improve both offensively and defensively. That is why the disaster thread is so important. It is a shame that a top ten pick may be given away--a pick that could have brought in a good young point guard or at least a small forward that could provide rotation depth.
Monroe for Chandler + a pick. Done deal, then we have a corner 3 point shooter who can defend small forwards. Then something something for Rondo. Bynum for something that isn't popcorn.
Can't trade Monroe, he a free agent when things open up again. Best we can do is a sign and trade if he wants to go to a team over the cap. With Falk as his agent he will get other offers and we will have to over pay to keep him. Sign and trades are mainly designed for max contract players who can get more by technically singing with their old teams. I dont see him getting those kinds of bucks. Other than that I think we are pretty close too. I would let Monroe walk and find a couple of vets for what we would have had to pay him. Nice defensive minded experienced players. I still like Smith and Jennings, just need a different system around them. How many teams have a guy like Drummond? Things are not that bad.
If we would have had the number one or two pick in 2012 and picked Drummond, I think we'd feel slightly better about ourselves. He's one of the best cornerstones in the league right now given his position, impact, attitude, and age.
Well. We did sign him. So, forget about it. And I think he's more than fine defensively at the four anyways.
I don't know that Drummond-Monroe could ever work together better than Drummond-Smith
Disagree with much of this. -Hate Jennings. -Don't think much of KCP, esp. not as a starter. -Don't like Stuckey for his price tag. -I'd never in a million years trade Greg Monroe for Wilson Chandler.
Did I miss somekind of a rule change where you can still trade free agents?
Sign-and-trade. Teams over the cap that want Monroe will have to part with someone to do it, and Detroit still has the ability to match any contract that other team offers. As long as they have leverage, trade options are still there.
I would not rely on a sign and trade. Lot of teams will have cap space this summer so only advatage for a sign an trade is if they want to pay Monroe the max of a returning FA that only Pistons can do. I cant see him getting a contract that large. We dont have a lot of leverage here. Teams are not going to give away players in a sign/trade just to be nice. Besides it will be him picking the team - not us.
I think it's really unfair that the NBA changed the CBA on Joe. He was really starting to get the hang of the last one.
Actually, the Pistons can match any offer if they want to keep him. The Pistons will likely extend another qualifying offer to Monroe this offseason, at which point he will become a restricted free agent; whatever another team offers, if the Pistons want to match it, he has to stay with them. That's their leverage, and is one of the primary reasons that restricted free agency even exists. They probably wouldn't get as much if that were the case, but that same leverage is how Detroit got Ben Wallace and Chucky Atkins for Grant Hill.
Looking ahead.... In the year 2016-17, our team salary total will only be $14,000,000.
Some general thoughts I have here, in response to the responses and additionally.. #1) GM. I'm guessing Phil Jackson would've been Gores' first choice. It sounds like he's probably going to take the Knicks job --- and that's great news, because I don't think he would've put the hours in. If I'm Tom Gores, there are three people I approach first.. -#1) Larry Brown. Next to Popovich, I still think he's about the best all-around basketball mind there is, and I think he'd more than put in the requisite hours. Dude seems to have burned all his NBA bridges. If I could get him to sign a contract with an ENORMOUS buyout, I'd throw him a life-line and give him total autonomy ~ the GM job and the HC'ing job (if he wants it.. if not, the autonomy to chose his own coach). -#2) R.C. Buford. He's the San Antonio Spurs "general manager", but, really, in name only ~ Popovich runs the show there. There's an outside chance he might be interested in running his own show here. -#3) Jerry Sloan. I'd offer him the same deal as Larry. I really respect him as a basketball mind, I think he'd be a real workaholic in the role, and I think he'd be a great philosophical fit for our city. #2) HC. If we do something besides hiring Larry Brown and Jerry Sloan --- and letting them be the HC or hand-pick their own HC --- or even if we do, there are again three names I'd look to. -#1) Rick Carlisle. I still really love him as a HC. Next to Popovich, I think he's about the best active HC there is in the league. And it seems like he's not all that appreciated by Mark Cuban in Dallas. Maybe he's getting a little nervous? Maybe a nice long-term, guaranteed contract in Detroit would interest him? -#2) Tom Izzo. If Izzo was smart, he'd be very interested in the Detroit Pistons' job. A) He looks completely burned out. Even the hardest NBA jobs are about half the work of a college job. Mainly because of the vicious year-long, endless recruiting cycle. B) MSU, IMO, is done for. State was good when he got to cherry-pick talent in the midwest. Since Ohio State, Indiana, Michigan and Kentucky have all emerged as real deal programs, he just hasn't been able to keep up. This year's team is the best team he's going to have for the foreseeable future, and it's not all that good. He loses Payne, Appling and Harris this year, brings in no stud recruits, and his go-to scorer is likely to be that Valentine bum. Getting an NBA team to play hard and listen to the coach is about 90% of the battle. And I think Izzo could do that - as well as excite the fan base a little bit. -#3) Lionel Hollins. He's proven himself as a solid top tier NBA coach. He's interested in the job. He'd make a lot of sense. #3) Greg Monroe. Greg's a center. Andre's a center. It doesn't work, plain and simple. But that doesn't mean that we should just give Greg away. IMO, he's a top-5 center in the league. He's 23 years old. And he's ideal intangibles-wise. He's worth A LOT. I wouldn't trade him for less than a top-5-ish pick or a young All-Star at another position. Go ahead and sign him to a max extension and shop him. Worst case, you've got three great big men on the roster, and there's nothing wrong with that (Ben, Sheed, Dyess). But there certainly could be something better --- like moving him for a young all-star 1, 2 or 3. #4) Brandon Jennings. He's terrible. It's hard enough to have a winning culture with J-Smith or Jennings. With both it's almost impossible. Jennings is awful defensively. He doesn't take coaching. He doesn't care about winning. He's terrible intangibles-wise. He's not really even a true point guard. I'd give him away for nothing, if I could. #5) Rest of the team. Stuckey-let go. Charlie-let go. Jerebko-bencher for another season, then let go (or resign real cheap). Bynum-bencher for another season, then let go (or resign real cheap). KCP, keep him on the bench and see if he can develop, I guess (not optimistic). Chauncey-bencher for another season, then hopefully assistant coach. Gigi-bencher for another season, then let go. Singler-bencher for another season, then let go (or resign real cheap). Harrelson-let go (or resign real cheap). Mitchell, keep him on the bench and see if he can develop (I am optimistic here). Siva, whatever.
What do you think we could get for Greg Monroe? In the '14 draft, with three projected plus-all-stars (Embiid, Wiggins, Parker), I don't think you could get a top-3 pick, but beyond that I think it's more or less open. *** *** -The Bucks could certainly use a center. -The Sixers could certainly use a center (and have two projected lotto picks). -The Celtics could certainly use a center. -The Lakers could certainly use a center (Gasol's more of a PF, and seemingly on his way out). -Denver could certainly use a center. -Cleveland could use a center. -Minnesota could use a center (Pekovic's decent, but not Monroe) *** *** -Orlando's got a nice center in Vucevic, and two projected lotto picks (but they might be interested in a big Vucevic, Monroe, Harris front-court?). -Sacramento's got a nice center in Boogie Cousins (but he cooould play the 4). -Utah's got Kanter and Favors (but Monroe would be an upgrade over either, IMO). -Charlotte, if they get our pick, have Al Jefferson (but Monroe would be an upgrade over him, or useful at the 4). -Memphis has Marc Gasol and Z-Bo, so I'm guessing they wouldn't be interested (but I'd rather have Monroe than Z-Bo for sure). *** *** So... 8 of the 14 projected lotto pick holders would be great landing spots for Monroe. And really, almost none of the teams with lotto picks trading for Monroe would be SHOCKING. What about young All-Stars? Looking at top-50-ish players.. -Some dude's are 4's or 5's: Dwight, Love, Griffin, M. Gasol, Aldridge, Dirk, Duncan, Bosh, Hibbert, Noah, Cousins, Z-Bo, Brook Lopez, Horford, P. Gasol, Garnett, Ibaka, A. Davis, D. Lee, A. Jefferson. -Some dude's are too old: Kobe, Parker, Wade, Iguodala, Pierce, J. Johnson (or too hurt - D. Rose). -Some dude's are about to be FA's: Gay, Deng. -Some dude's are off limits for Monroe: LeBron, Durant, Paul, Melo (you'd think), Harden, Irving, Curry (I'd imagine), George (I'd imagine). That leaves us with these options: PG: Westbrook, Lillard, Rondo, J. Holliday, R. Rubio, J. Wall, T. Lawson, D. Williams....M. Conley SG: M. Ellis (do not like-Defense) SF: K. Leonard, D. DeRozan OKC loves Westbrook, I'm sure. But what they have hasn't been working out all that well. Maybe they don't need two ball-dominant stars in Durant and Westbrook? Maybe KD would benefit more from a dominant low-post player like Greg? The Blazers love Lillard, I'm sure, but with Robin Lopez as their starting center, Aldridge at the 4 (nice), Batum at the 3 (nice), Matthews at the 2 (ok) and that McCollum kid they just drafted at the 1 in the wings...they might be interested. The Celtics, of course, love Rondo. But that squad is absolutely bare. And Rondo's more of a complimentary player than a leading scorer? He is getting a little old (28) though. The Pelicans might be interested in moving Holiday to build a great front-line of Monroe and Davis? Minnesota could use a center and might be interested in Rubio for Monroe? The Wizards have zilch in the front court and might be interested in Monroe for Wall? Denver's got no front-court and might be interested in Monroe for Lawson? Deron's a little over the hill at 29, but with Garnett about to retire, they'd certainly be interested in Monroe. San Antonio's never had a center, and Duncan's getting up there in age, so they'd definitely be interested in Monroe for Leonard. The Raptors don't have a center and might be interested in a Monroe for DeRozan swap? I'm not a big Monta Ellis fan, at all, but with no center and Dirk getting up there in age, Dallas would definitely be interested in Monroe for Ellis. .....Memphis probably wouldn't be all that interested in a Conley-Monroe swap with M. Gasol and Z-Bo in place.
Monroe is not a good player. He doesn't defend well, and he's got no jumpshot. I don't understand why people get sentimental about him, he's been good (not great) player on bad teams.
They got Ben for Grant because Orlando needed the cap space. No one is obligated to Sing/Trade once an offer sheet is agreed to. Its true the Pistons can match just a question if they want to or not. If they want to max out cap space on Monroe and come back with the same tired front line next year.
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