Ben Gordon: It's Time to Cut Bait

Discussion in 'Pistons and NBA' started by Slippy, Feb 14, 2012.

  1. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    Keep in mind that this isn't Ben's fault though. He has a great attitude and is willing to come off the bench.

    He just got major paid because of GM malpractice.
     
  2. BallDon'tLie

    BallDon'tLie All-Star 3x Fantasy Champion

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    JJ Reddick added some hustle to his game this year.
    He's actually a decent defender now and is scrappy as all get-out.
     
  3. BallDon'tLie

    BallDon'tLie All-Star 3x Fantasy Champion

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    I agree with this TaS.
    If "being professional" actually had any value in the NBA he might actually be tradeable.
     
  4. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    I find Ben pretty scrappy too. I think his defensive limitations are more physical than mental. Also, the waste factor in his contract is probably slightly less than that of Villanueva.

    We get zero value out of Charlie No Hustle while we get partial value out of Gordon.
     
  5. Walter

    Walter All-Star Forum Donor

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    Great point. Even though Gordon is overpaid, CV is the worse contract.
     
  6. BillLaimbeer

    BillLaimbeer All-Star 4x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    Well, I'm sure every team has some players that it is over-paying and others that it is under-paying. The question is "Are you getting the most bang for your buck?". One way to look at it would be to suppose the season ended today. How much did each team pay for each victory?

    [​IMG]

    Well, Oklahoma City has managed 22 wins out of a $56 million payroll. They must be doing something right.

    The Bobcats, on the other had, have managed only 3 wins out of their $57 million payroll.

    The Pistons are in the bottom third in money spent per win. They have the 2nd smallest payroll in the NBA at $49 million and have manage 9 victories.

    Do these rankings accurately reflect how well the GM is doing?
     
  7. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    You'd have to go further and look at the overall profitability of each team. It may make sense to pay more for each victory than another team if you make it up in fan attendance, etc. Although, we can't really get a good look at the income statements.

    In looking at your table- are we really the 2nd lowest payroll in the NBA (with Bengo and Villanueva as a big chunk of it?)? That's amazing.

    If we are the 2nd lowest payroll and only the 3rd or 4th worst team, then I'd say Joe is doing a heck of a job!
     
  8. BillLaimbeer

    BillLaimbeer All-Star 4x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    Only the Kings have a lower payroll. The teams with the lowest payrolls go head-to-head tonight. The two worst teams...and we still have over $95 million on the floor.
     
  9. Walter

    Walter All-Star Forum Donor

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    That is amazing that we are the 2nd lowest payroll in the NBA.

    Pacers are paying $1M more, but that extra million got them twice the wins we have.
     
  10. Walter

    Walter All-Star Forum Donor

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    Wait, something doesn't add up. I just summed up the salaries as reported on the trade machine and that puts us at $57.7M.
     
  11. coynejeremy

    coynejeremy All-Star Administrator 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    Based on TaShawn's numbers, I have to think that our rock-bottom offensive pace is majorly to blame for Ben's low stat lines here. Wonder what Chicago's possession rates were when he played there?
     
  12. BillLaimbeer

    BillLaimbeer All-Star 4x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    I got the numbers here: http://hoopshype.com/salaries.htm

    I have a feeling that they aren't completely accurate....
     
  13. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    I think that his overall lowered stat lines are a result of:
    1) lower minutes for him
    2) slower pace when he's on the court
    3) lower percentage of Pistons possessions that he shoots the ball

    #3 shows up in the "usage" stat, which is the % of plays that went through him when he was on the floor:

    Year- usage:
    05- 30.4
    06- 26.3
    07- 29.3
    08- 26.0
    09- 25.0
    10- 24.5
    11- 21.5
    12- 24.4

    His lowest 3 years of usage have come with us. 23.5% average usage with us vs. 27.4% average with the Bulls. That is a 14% usage decrease with the Pistons.

    Villanueva's usage has dropped from a career average of 24% to 0% lately.
     
  14. Slippy

    Slippy All-Star Administrator Forum Donor

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    Most sites with pistons salary info doesn't include Prince/Stuckey's contract. We should be at $64 mil.
     
  15. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    I wonder what kind of GM contract Joe would sign himself to if it was his decision.
     
  16. BillLaimbeer

    BillLaimbeer All-Star 4x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    He certainly wouldn't let an asset like himself just walk away for nothing. I'd say $36 million/4 years, plus all-you-can-eat popcorn and unlimited Blackberry minutes for life.
     
  17. TaS

    TaS All-Star Forum Donor

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    That's why I set you up Bill.
     
  18. Ernie the Slow Adult

    Ernie the Slow Adult All-Star Forum Donor

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    How much $$ were the Bulls willing to pay Gordon approximately? You got to wonder how much he lost by leaving there. They still have a spot for him and they might have won the title last year if he was still there.

    He'd be a star had he stayed in CHI and now at best he's either forgotten or worse, a punchline.
     
  19. BallDon'tLie

    BallDon'tLie All-Star 3x Fantasy Champion

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    Even the internet has a hard time grasping the concept of those two contracts.
    ...The same internet that made a piano playing cat famous.
     
    dba and Slippy like this.
  20. Mogilny

    Mogilny All-Star Forum Donor

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    Bengos birthday celebration.



    Tay and Knight spent countless hours dressing up for the occasion.
     

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