Discussion in 'November 2010' started by roscoe36, Oct 19, 2010.
here's what tads posted on DBB game thread:
and that pretty much sums up our collapse.
All about the team chemistry now. Doesn't look good for the immediate future of the team. Looks like a 21 win team.
I'LL SAY FOR THE LAST TIME...watch the movie 'major league'!!!!
This is as plotted a team blow up as the 9-11 plane hijackings!!
That's almost a transcript of how the Atlanta announcers sounded during the fourth quarter.
A small reflection after watching through the boxscores after a night like this - Monroe might have trouble in the ECF if we encounter Orlando there. One of their guys had 8 blocks in 23 minutes tonight.
Lots of drama coming I guess.
Prince PG down the stretch, but finishes with zero assists in the game? One of those 2 things should not have happened.
36-90 for the Pistons from the floor.
36-67 for the Hawks from the floor.
We crushed them on the boards and won the turnover war to get this differential, but there is a reason that we were missing so many shots and they were > 50%. They have a cohesive defense with a shot blocker and we have poor defenders who aren't used to playing with each other. 1 weak link can be overcome, but when you have several, they'll just hammer away at them and there's not much than you can do to stop them.
Therein lies the asymmetry between offense and defense. You can get away with having Ben Wallace on the offensive end of the court since there is only one basketball. He's good for setting picks, dunking, getting easy layups, etc. But it's hard to get away with having a weak player on defense. When you have 2 or 3 of them, there is no covering for it and you have a screen door on your submarine.
I have very incomplete information making any predictions or anaysis I have not worth a damn. But it occurs to me that everyone is totally frustrated. Kuester has almost no chance to throw a competitive lineup out there, given JJ's hurt, Monroe's a 20 year old rookie big man, Wallace is our only legit big man (and he's small and not Ben of old), and the team is playing with lots of injuries.
On top of that, though, it seems to me like Kuester is trying his hardest to regain control of his team. Players seem to be sniping with him - a lot. He just punished the guys on the team who were playing tonight by sitting Stuckey - even if Stuckey was insubordinate in some way (which really seem unlike Rodney, doesn't it?) him sitting Stuckey couldn't have set well with his teammates since that forced McGrady to play tons of minutes, and possibly cost us our first win.
I was glad to get a glimpse of the future with Monroe in the high post - man he looks great there, really in control and surveying the floor beautifully. It'll be nice when Daye relaxes. He's playing really tight. You know he's a great shooter - and his percentages will catch up with his ability when he regains his confidence.
But if Stuckey suddenly becomes a problem, that's an enormous setback for this franchise.
Weird game, in many aspects. How about McGrady playing a season high 24 minutes after leaving the game just yesterday with a slight knee problem. How about Stuckey only getting 14 minutes.
But one thing remained rock solid. Pistons late game collapses. Still no sign of a coach anywhere around winning time.
I see some criticize Summers for not being great around the basket. Its not his game. The one time they let him shoot a three, he nailed it. Thats his game, let him play it. I do believe Summers was our 2nd best in 3 percentage last year. He can shoot that 3, let him.
McGrady did some scoring in this one, at the basket. Created by him. Nice pass on a fast break to Monroe. He is moving a little better. Certainly not great. Still not seeing him knock down 3's, his signature scoring mode for his career. But regardless of how healthy he is, one trend continues - this team is just as good with him out there as the point vs. when Stuckey is at point. Just not a lot of difference.
Kuester calls timeouts, and puts in plays. He does not recognize that people have simply been out there too long. He tends to ride a player to the point they are worthless. Security blanket type thing I suppose. Rotations were just well, weird.
Ben Wallace, not seen in the 2nd or 4th quarters. Daye, despite playing quite an effective game (when not playing at power forward), sees I believe no crunch time action.
JMAX got a DNP, coach's decision.
Tay had a particulary good game - until it came to crunch time where he disappeared like the rest. Even though he was out there playing.
The good - we played competitively, had a 6 point lead late (around the 5 minute mark), and this against a team with some obvious talent. The youth for sure was not sitting rotting on the bench. Coach mitigated his craziness in starting Daye at power forward by at least taking him out real early in each half. With no foul trouble. Wow, he actually made a decison not forced on him. And yet, he still insists on starting Daye at PF, when, well, probably the whole world thinks by now that Monroe should be starting along side Ben Wallace. (And how about a Ben Gordon / Austin Daye rotation at shooting guard.)
CV is doing better, but no way he should play the minutes he does lately.
More good news. This has been a horrific schedule to start the season. Since last Wednesday, the Pistons have played 5 games. Might as well say five games in one week. Despite the announcers crying about injuries, really injuries have not hurt us. For instance, how can you say we were hurt by JJ being injured, when even without JJ Kuester could not find time for Monroe to play the first couple of games. Bynum? Why give the other team someone to shoot over? Rip? We got Gordon, and Daye - who needs Rip. This team has no shortage of talented players. The team just needs a coach who can get his act together. Quit being stubborn and put Monroe in the starting unit.
Are we really short handed when the coach can afford to sit his point guard for pretty much the whole game. How about up front - lets see - he did not even play one of his normal rotation players. (Maxiell). Nope, no shortage of players. Injuries are not a problem. Probably the company line being bandied about to cover for Kuester.
More good stuff. Gordon and CV, within like a minute, each had a block. Both are scoring well of late. Gordon started this one out scorching hot with 11 or so in the first quarter. TMAC is getting better on foot speed, even if slowly. Coach certainly is not wearing out Stuckey nor Ben Wallace. (Still overplaying Tay though.) We started out the game at least looking like we knew how to play hoops, getting inside and to the line a lot. Tapered out though as the game went on. Only one first half turnover. And we had them 8-1 at one point on O boards.
The real bad: Can't get back on fast breaks. Which is understandable with the odd rotations Kuester uses. If you want guys to run faster, play them in shorter spurts. And inside defense. Very lacking much of the game. Part of that is starting Daye at power forward, and part of that is overplaying CV.
In defense of Detroit tonight, hey, Atlanta showed it not only has a great fast break game, and ability to score around the basket, but that Atlanta also knows how to shoot the outside shot. Just a lot of talent on display. Lots of tall players who can nail the shot from the perimeter. Just possible we win this one if Atlanta does not shoot such a high outside percentage. Sometimes its just not in the stars.
And I see from another board that Stuckey was pulled for not running the plays called from the bench.
Hmm, I did not notice anyone posting that the Pistons did not extend Stuckey's contract - making him a free agent after this season. Just might have something to do with the rift.
Agree with your points that you can't complain about being short handed when you are sitting Stuckey, Maxiell, and Ben Wallace. Seems like we are overloaded.
On the contract issue, hardly anybody is getting signed. Afflalo, and many others, despite great play. Lockout looming.
On the schedule... Atlanta has also played 5 games already, and they are undefeated.
We are only 2.0 games out of the playoffs at this point though.
And coach won't pull the guy, like he is absolutely not watching the game.
It is odd to hear of this behavior from Stuckey. You would not expect this type of attitude from a guy who pokes holes in his belt instead of buying a new one after he loses weight.
The bad: My DVR froze up and erased the game so I could only watch the first 6 minutes or so of the first Q.
ESPN running winless Pistons fall to 0-5 as the lead on their scroll.
KG's retort to CG's twitter comments. That has got to rank up with it being reported that Rip and Tay were crying after CB was traded as a low point in Piston history.
Another good offensive game from BG. T-Mac did pretty well finishing around the rim, two double clutch reverse layups, and made some good passes. Tay played well.
I thought Monroe was excellent for his first game with a substantial amount of PT. He really got after loose balls and rebounds, and man does that dude see the court. I know that people were praising his passing ability, but I didn't expect it to be as good as hyped up to be.
Stuckey barely played...while this puzzles me. Not to mention he is on my fantasy team, and 5 points is just not going to cut it...
I don't get on BG and CV as much for bad D, but MAN OH MAN, Charlie V made Zaza Pachulia look like Al Jefferson tonight.
Now...what reason does Joe D have not to fire Coach Q at this point? He's lost his team completely, and he is very bad in crunch time.
Stuckey wouldn't listen to him.
Tayshaun on Kue's leader comments: "It goes both ways," Prince said. "He says we got to be more vocal; he has to do some things better, too. Obviously we’re 0-4, so it ain’t just the team."
McGrady clearly unhappy about being taken out in the fourth.
Greg Monroe should be starting, yet it took Kue an entire 5 games to give him substantial time..
are you sure that this is actually "the bad?"
We need to petition the NBA to cut the game down from 48minutes to 40 (like in college & FIBA), if they did we'd be 4-1. I think we have enough talent to compete and play .500 ball, but with Clueless on the bench, and NOBODY respecting him ............... But I will say this, if Stuckey was insubordinate, he should be benched! But if you're going to bench Stuckey for it then hold everyone else equally accountable. T-Mac, Gordon and Monroe looked good. Anyone else notice that we have a team full of 6'11" guys who can't dunk the ball off of a drop step or standing vertical jump ......... heaven help us!
I don't know.. I'm watching games and SEEMS THAT THIS TEAM IS TANKING FOR TEH SEASON..
HEY but WAIT!.. It's NOVEMBER!.. WTF?
I posted it on Monday in the Articles Worth Mentioning thread. A couple of people responded.. but I figured nobody cared... Maybe I should have created a separate thread so you all could have debated it.
For all the bad moves Kuester has pulled in this game and all others, I appreciate that he went to Monroe in the high-post for a bit. That is going to be his sweet spot, and it would be very beneficial to put him there with the ball constantly when he's on the floor. Simply making him the mop-up guy, in typical Pistons fashion, would be a mistake. I noticed that as soon as Tay stepped on the floor, those high-post touches stopped. (Shocking)
In other (old) news. The Daye experiment @ PF needs to end. With Rip out there should be plenty of minutes for Daye as a backup wing.
Kuester is taking shots at Stuckey. He must have a death wish clashing with a young franchise player like this.
Hawks surge past winless Pistons in fourth quarter | detnews.com | The Detroit News
Three-pointers: Rodney Stuckey benched as Detroit Pistons collapse again | MLive.com
So Rodney pulls a Scottie Pippen? That's not on the coach...that's all on Rodney.
that is interesting. Rodney probably expected: leadership=glory and respect and power, instead of it he has to drag this messy team through the mud.
Also vets are either aging ( ben wallace), passive( tay) or simply don't care ( rip), so it is not hard to be either commanding or vocal even for youngstas but nobody probaly wants this role now.
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