Allen Iverson

Discussion in 'Pistons and NBA' started by cwolfson, Jul 2, 2006.

  1. cwolfson

    cwolfson First Round Draft Pick

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    Hi, everyone. I'm new to the forum ... the Detnews Pistons Talk forum wasn't especially inspiring.

    I saw my first Pistons game back in 1963 in Cobo Arena when I was 10 (they got creamed by the Lakers, but I saw one more that season where they nipped the Knicks by 2). I've been a Pistons fan ever since.

    I've lived in Sydney, Australia for the last 20 years, but thanks to cable TV and the internet, I can follow sport as closely as if I was still living in Ann Arbor, Michigan (which I did from 1971-78 and 81-85).

    Anyway, watching the NBA draft the other day, and hearing the discussion about Allen Iverson being traded, I thought (not that there's any realistic likelihood of it happening) that he could be just what the Pistons need, replacing Rip Hamilton.

    I think Iverson is a much maligned player with a bad rep among many fans that's undeserved. He's a hard as nails warrior who shows up every night and is there with his 20+ to 30+ points, exactly the go-to kind of guy the Pistons don't have to avoid the scoring droughts they plunge into that are such killers. If he came to the Pistons, I suspect he'd be a Rasheed Wallace type who proved his true character in a different environment.

    I like Rip Hamilton, but Iverson has a long range game, as well as attacking the basket, neither of which are strong suits for Rip. And Rip is hardly the linch pin of the Pistons defense. I thought the thing that really stymied the Pistons vs. Miami was that Rip was never left free for that run around midrange pass and shoot play he does so well, which basically shut down his, and the Pistons', offense.

    Sorry if this has been discussed here before. As I say, I'm new today to this forum.
  2. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    Welcome to the board seawolf! ;)

    The only issue I see is that Iverson is a little small to play the 2. But he did have a MVP season doing that under Larry Brown with Eric Snow as the starting PG so...

    It's 3:30 AM Detroit local, but I'm sure the boys will be around tomorrow to respond to your post.
  3. linwood

    linwood All-Star

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    Iverson is my favorite non-Piston basketball player.

    I have been thinking of a Billups for Iverson trade, but haven't really considered a Rip/Iverson deal. Not sure how I feel about it...could be interesting.
  4. cwolfson

    cwolfson First Round Draft Pick

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    I've obviously come to the right place. When I suggested this on the detnews board, all I got were some, "NO NO, clubhouse cancer, no D!" type kneejerk replies.

    Hey, Roscoe, how do you know I go by the alternate "Seawolf" handle?
  5. hack

    hack First Round Draft Pick

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    I'm new here too. Seems odd to come to a board and start tossing out trade scenarios involving the face of the franchise, but, 'tis the season...

    With Billups the salaries don't work, and it could be tough with Rip too. Possibly a 2-starters for 1 deal, unless we love Dalembert. So the Sixers sudden interest in Ben, if it's geniune, is really interesting. Leaves us available to make another trade to fill the hold that Ben would leave. A gaping hole, but Iverson's got a bunch going for him that we're not going to get anywhere else:

    1. the penetrator we've been lacking

    2. The playoff scorer we've been lacking

    3. The heart/effort we've been lacking

    4. He's still the biggest draw on the road and his jersey's a top seller. That means that if he got back in the playoffs under these new rules, he could get the Wade star treatment. Even if he got a fraction of Wade's whistles, it's enough.

    5. Contract: it's massive, but it's also, in two years when our window's likely to be closed, a wonderful trading chip.

    6. Because of the downside, he'll come at an extremely cheap price for what he'd bring. We're one of the few teams for whom it makes sense to take on that contract at this time.

    Overall: get that guy in here! His effort and heart will breathe new life into the rest of our guys. His will to win is pretty strong, get him within sniffing distance of a ring and mayhe he goes nuts with an all-time performance. Even if he doesn't, what he brings is probably enough. Agreed that there's an issue on defence, but we won in 04 with a backcourt that was worse defensively than they are now. So if you want to win with defense, you need a frontcourt, not a backcourt.

    Iverson isn't a perfect fit, but pretty ideal. Please don't give him #3, though. That's Ben's for good.
  6. Slippy

    Slippy All-Star Administrator Forum Donor

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    I like AI but not for RIP. Rip has that off the ball game that makes the team work smoother. AI tends to dominate the ball.

    We need different weapons though...I'd go for a 3 guard rotation.
  7. himat

    himat Bench Warmer

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    Allen is my favorite player, but we'd have to give away at least 2 starters for AI which I wouldn't be willing to do.
  8. Winless Wonders

    Winless Wonders Starter Forum Donor

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    Iverson? Interesting.

    I for one say when ever you lose it is time to go back to the drawing board. I am not for staying pat. I think we need some hungry players that want that ring. I don't see the hunger in our Pistons. The only guy that really was hungry was McDyess. Maybe the guys were tired because we did not have a bench but even if they were at full power we don't have anyone that can stop Wade and Ben Wallace on Shaq is a joke. I don't know if I would trade Rip for Iverson and even if we did the salaries would not match up so we would have to add more players or get another team involved.

    Also Iverson takes alot of shots to get his points. The Pistons offense right now is pretty balanced so I don't think he would fit the Pistons team as it is now. I do like his slashing ablity though and his ablity to create off the dribble and make teams stop him. The only way this deal works is if you re-up Chauncey's deal and then send him for Iverson. Not sure if I really would want to do that considering that Iverson is older. Flip proably would not stand for it either.
  9. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    cwolfson, seawolf, I took a wild guess when I saw your posting at the Detroit News board. Seawolf was from Australia as well.

    Speaking of which, we've got at least threee aussie regulars. jimm, majestik, and webz.

    Honestly I like the Iverson move, but only as a last ditch S&T with Wallace. His salary is an albatross.

    Maybe Wallace and our Mid-Level for Iverson, bring Rip off the bench.
  10. hack

    hack First Round Draft Pick

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    I'd think we can't keep our starting backcourt, even if one is benched. One should be traded for a big.
  11. lurker

    lurker First Round Draft Pick

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    If I had both AI and Rip, I'd want to play them together as much as possible. Trying to defend them both at once would be a nightmare for opposing coaches. Imagine the wide-open shot opportunities for everybody.
  12. ahb

    ahb Bench Warmer

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    An Iverson/Billups backcourt? Iverson, Billups, and Prince on the perimeter trying to play defense? :wacko:

    It would be nice if the Pistons found a way to get rid of Billups anyway, but if they acquire Iverson, Billups has to go. He's essentially a poor man's Iverson without the speed... or handle... or passing ability... or finishing ability... or ability to get to the line... or field goal percentage...

    And getting rid of the only one of Chauncey, Rip, and Tayshaun who played even acceptable defense last season doesn't sound like a great idea to me, even in the "new NBA".
  13. linwood

    linwood All-Star

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    That should certainly solve our offensive woes.
  14. jammertime

    jammertime Starter 1x Fantasy Champion Forum Donor

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    Yeah, I'd rather lose CB than Rip.
  15. hack

    hack First Round Draft Pick

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    It's tough to believe that Iverson will wait 10 seconds for Rip to come off screens before wanting to do something with the ball. I have an easier time believing that Billups could play well off the ball, spotting up and posting. I really like his post game and wish we'd see it more. He's got better touch from that position than from driving, which he isn't quick enough to do regularly anyways. Plus, at Iverson's age, letting Billups bring the ball up and initiate the offense is a good idea.

    Since I'm new, I'm interested in why people here are down on Billups. I'm a little puzzled about him at the moment, and don't if the offensive meltdown is partly his doing or all Flip's.
  16. MOTOWNMAN

    MOTOWNMAN Second Round Draft Pick

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    Iverson is a great player. He is fearless and get pentrate. But what would we give up to get him?

    I am new here as well

    Love the PF great job!
  17. mjfeld

    mjfeld Second Round Draft Pick

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    Hey I am new here I kind of got sick of the detroit news form since pistonsheart talks constantly and has proposed a trade involving every piston not named tayshaun prince.

    I only like the idea of aquiring ai if we don't keep ben wallace, but I mean if philly wants ben i really doubt they are goin to do a sign and trade with ai, but if they do we could sign ben to like a 15 million dollar contract add chauncey and maybe like dale davis and aquire samuel dalembert and iverson. Therefore u have iverson rip prince sheed dalembert and a bench of mcdyess delfino and whoever else the pistons try to aquire. I am not sure how well it will work but we do need a superstar to carry the load of scoring sometimes and get us out of scoring droughts and iverson is one of the best at scoring.

    Also I have heard KG name mentioned but this doesn't seem as plausible as AI cuz KG doesn't want to leave (yet) and timberwolves don't want to trade him.
  18. MOTOWNMAN

    MOTOWNMAN Second Round Draft Pick

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    is Dalembert a FA? I like his rebounding and energy off the bench. I think if we keep Ben maybe Philly might want Sheed and a draft pick for AI? I dont think the salaries match up.

    And please Roscoe keep the Pistonheart moron off PF!
  19. roscoe36

    roscoe36 All-Star Administrator

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    mjfeld, you bring up an interesting idea. If the 76ers would take a $15 million dollar Ben, with say Delfino or Maxiell thrown in as filler (or the Orlando 2007 pick), Iverson could be brought to Detroit.

    Because Chauncey has a trade kicker (trade bonus) it makes it very hard to include him in a trade. That's why the bonus exists. As a deterrent to trading the player without compensation, and the only easy way around it is for the player to waive his bonus.

    I think it is very unlikely that CB will be traded during this contract. Iverson would have to play the 2 because Billups is not a real 2 guard.
  20. ahb

    ahb Bench Warmer

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    I was afraid of that, but couldn't find a definitive answer quickly. His contract expires in a year, anyway, so there's nothing urgent.

    Say no to Dalembert.

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